Vitamin D

My visits here have been few and far between and I haven't been able to read every post, just as many as I can.  I just read a couple of posts referring to vitamin D and wanted to add something --- if it's already been discussed here, sorry, just disregard.

Just recently, I have run into several people whose 'regular' Drs have prescribed 50,000 units of Vite D per week. (all at once) This dose also matches the dose I hear about on talk radio 'informercials' by a major supplement company, whose name escapes me.  Now, it is really interesting that regular Drs have now gotten into testing folks' vite D levels and prescribing it. My mother is one.

My father is 81 and about a year ago he fell and injured his shoulder. The Dr found an injured rotator cuff (sp?) and said that there was nothing that could be done about it.  He had some physical therapy for awhile, but it only hurt and he never felt any improvement. ** He is NOT a chronic complainer, but he suffered quite a bit of constant pain from it.

Anyway, awhile back I started taking D3 supps -- 300-400 units per day. After hearing the infomercials on the radio, I upped to 1000 units per day and soon increased to 2000 per day.  And I convinced my Dad to take at least 2000 units per day. He continued this for quite a few months and the past 3 weeks he finally said that his shoulder felt MUCH better and he had very little pain!  I really believe it is the Vite D3.  I'm pushing him to get the 5000 unit gels and he said that he would. It's pretty wild that all of a sudden physicians are paying attention to this!

And altho I don't know what or if 5000 units per day are doing for me, I'm gonna do it the rest of my life, because supposedly there are 26 organs that will benefit, the immune systems should benefit, along w/ bones & joints, the brain, prevention of many types of cancer, etc.  In fact, I may up my dose to the recommended 50,000 units per week.

I am clearly not cured, but I honestly believe that everyone here should get onto 2000-5000 units of D3 per day, if not more.  And it is recommended to take it w/ Omega 3 fish oils.

CAN'T HURT!! 

OK but how do you tolerate it. I tried upping my dose and it did not agree with me. Any suggestions?

I take liquid Vitamin D that I buy from Costco..  I take it because I don't want to be out in the sun because the sun is very dangerous and my baby brother passed away from melanoma skin cancer all because he got too much sun one day..    The rate of skin cancer is higher than ever..  So please be careful when you go out and wear a strong sunscreen..

Denise

springsjean, I'm sorry, I have not heard of anyone having a problem tolerating it -- maybe you aren't deficient and it's harmful fo ryou?

I also am very low on Vitamin D but I cannot sleep at all when I take supplements. I don't know why...maybe it goes after the Lyme and it is a herx?

Also, when doctors prescribe 50,000 IU Vitamin D, it is usually in the Vitamin D2 form (ergocalciferol) and not the D3 form (cholecalciferol). My understanding is that the D2 form has to be converted by the body somehow into a useable form first, which means one has to take more of it to get the same impact as taking the D3 form.

Also, I believe suncreen is the #1 reason that people are low in Vitamin D even if they spend a lot of time outdoors...and those who live too far North cannot get enough Vitamin D even in Summer due to the low sun angle.

My Husband's Endocrinologist says the body uses 4-6000 IU/day Vitamin D, so it makes sense to supplement with at least 2000IU and maybe more if one is deficient. I agree taking it with Omega-3 EFA's is a good idea too because Vitamin D is a fat-soluble vitamin, and will absorb much better if taken with fat.

Take care,

CajunGrl said, "The test to check you Vitamin D levels is called 25-hydroxy-vitamin D and 1,25 dihydroxy-vitamin D. It is my understanding that both of these need to be checked". Yes! That is the test you want to get to see if you are vitamin D deficient. Thank you for posting that!

Razzle, actually, vitamin D3 is known to be more effective than D2. The fact that doctors may prescribe D2 doesn't really validate the fact that D2 is better for you. If you read about Lyme disease (or any chronic disease) and which of the two vitamins D's are recommended, vitamin D3 will almost always be the D vitamin of choice by LLMD's and LLND's.

If you want to read the scientific evidence behind this, there is good study that was done comparing Vitamins D3 and D2. It's long and boring to those of us who are "scientifically challenged", not to mention, it's a lot of reading which isn't easy for some of us lymies who have problems concentrating. But in a nutshell, here is what it says without reading the whole article which I will post a link to:

"To our knowledge, this is the first study comparing vitamins D3 and D2 by mapping the time course of serum 25OHD after a single dose. We showed that vitamin D3 raises and maintains 25OHD levels to a substantially greater degree than does vitamin D2, with a differential potency of at least 3-fold, and more likely closer to 10-fold."

Source to the full study here: jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/89/11/5387

Here's another article that supports vitamin D3 over D2 and explains why:

--Vitamin D2 and/or Vitamin D3

There are two types of vitamin D supplements available for over-the-counter purchase (vitamin D2 and vitamin D3).

Vitamin D3 is the type that most experts believe should be utilized in clinical practice (Wolpowitz & Gilchrest, 2006).

Vitamin D2 is also known as "ergocalciferol," and vitamin D3 is also known as "cholecalciferol." This is important for patients who have purchased a dietary supplement that does not indicate the specific type of vitamin D in the product by number but have listed the scientific name.

Most experts now believe that the only form that should be purchased is vitamin D3. Vitamin D2 is also very acceptable, but in the author’s opinion, most individuals should switch to D3. There is a plethora of logical reasons for advocating the use of vitamin D3 over vitamin D2 dietary supplements (Wolpowitz, & Gilchrest, 2006), including:

UVB light from the sun strikes the skin, and humans synthesize vitamin D3, so it is the most "natural" form.

Human beings do not make vitamin D2, and most healthy fish contain vitamin D3.

Vitamin D3 is the same price as vitamin D2.

Vitamin D3 may be less toxic than D2 because higher concentrations of D2 circulate in the blood when consumed (compared to vitamin D3). It does not bind as well to the receptors in the human tissues compared to vitamin D3.

Vitamin D3 is the more potent form of vitamin D, which is a potential benefit. For example, obesity tends to lower blood levels of vitamin D, so a more potent form is needed.

Vitamin D3 is more stable on the shelf compared to D2, and is more likely to remain active for a longer period of time and when exposed to different conditions (temperature, humidity, and storage). This is perhaps why the amount of vitamin D2 in certain fortified food products have been significantly lower than that advertised on the label in numerous instances.

Vitamin D3 has been the most utilized form of vitamin D in clinical trials, and there have only been a few clinical trials of vitamin D2 to prevent bone fractures in adults.

Vitamin D3 is more effective at raising and maintaining the vitamin D blood test (again, D2 binds less tightly to the vitamin D receptors in the body; therefore, D2 does not circulate as long in the body, which means it has a shorter half-life).

Vitamin D2 is a fungus/yeast-derived product, and it was first produced in the early 1920s by exposing foods to ultraviolet light (Wolpowitz & Gilchrest, 2006). This process was patented and licensed to pharmaceutical companies.

Currently, many major prescription forms of vitamin D are actually vitamin D2 and not vitamin D3. Vitamin

D2 is synthetically made from radiating a compound (ergosterol) from the mold ergot.

Vitamin D3 is made commercially and synthetically in a similar way that it is produced intrinsically in human and animal skin when exposed to UVB light. Wool sources of 7-dehydrocholesterol are used (from cholesterol), and irradiatied to form active vitamin D3. Vegetarians or especially vegans may be opposed to the use of vitamin D3 supplementation because it is derived from an animal source, and these individuals should be guided to the vitamin D2 form. Multivitamins have either vitamin D2 or D3, but many companies are now utilizing mostly vitamin D3. Cod liver oil has vitamin D3 in it.

Rickets, a defect in bone growth in infancy and childhood, was first identified in 1650 (Welch, Bergstrom, & Tsang, 2000). It was not until 1922 that medical research demonstrated that something in cod liver oil prevented and cured rickets.

Additionally, vitamin D2 added to milk in the United States and Europe in the 1930s essentially eliminated rickets (disease of weak bones in children) or osteomalacia (same disease of weak bones but in adults). Currently, fortification with vitamin D2 or D3 has continued to keep rickets scarce in North America. The minimum amount of vitamin D needed to prevent rickets is 100 IU (2.5 mcg) per day in infants with little to no sun exposure.--

Source of this article above: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/589256_4

While taking vitamin D2 can be helpful, it's much better to take D3 for all of the reasons stated above. I do agree that you should be tested by a doctor to determine if you are deficient in vitamin D, but I believe getting vitamin D3 drops are far more beneficial and effective than vitamin D2. If you do a google search I believe the evidence supports this.

By the way, speaking of vitamins, Dr. S who wrote the book, "The Lyme Disease Solution" has a list of supplements (D3 included) that he believes all Lyme patients should be taking. I think he's pretty much spot on. I take all of the supplements he has on his list for Lyme patients except for vitamin A. Maybe that's something I might add to my daily supplement intake. Anyone have comments on this?

Source: www.lymebook.com/lyme-disease-diet-and-supplements-vitamin-a-b-c-magnesium

Gary

Post Edited (GWB) : 5/15/2010 6:58:32 PM (GMT-6)

Razzle, actually you were clear in explaining it. I went back and reread what you wrote and now I see I didn't read closely enough what you were saying and misunderstood you. Sorry bout that!

What I posted is good information for those who may not know the difference between the two. Vitamin D is a very important vitamin, especially for those of us who suffer with chronic diseases.

Gary

Razzle, if a person is allergic to lanolin then D3 obviously isn't the answer for them. It's very possible they would have an allergic reaction to it, but some people who take D3, who are allergic to lanolin, seem to do alright with it. Seems best not to take the risk if a person knows they're allergic to it, I would think.

Some people who are vegans won't take D3 because it comes from an animal source. People like this have two options, they would have to take vitamin D2 (plant source), or as Dr. Mercola suggests, get a tanning bed.

http://tanningbeds.mercola.com/tanning-beds/standup-tanning-systems.aspx/?aid=CD411

Gary

I'm taking 20,000 iu per day of liquid D3 in olive oil base. (10 drops at 2000 per drop)
Does that sound like too much? My D level was low at only 27.

Gary,
Yes my doctor requested that I take that much since my levels were so low
What would be the side effects of too much vit D?

Kodak,

That does sound like alot of vitamin D. Did your doctor prescribe that amount? Like Gary said, the highest dose is "usually" 50,000IU a week. I've seen someone taking more, but only under their doctor's guidance.

So one should have both the 25 and the 1,25 Vitamin D level checked first before supplementing with Vitamin D.

Regarding the Vite A question: I USED (keyword) to study the vitamins a lot -- oh, about 30 yrs ago when I worked for the original MOther Earth News. Don't take this as gospel, but here is what I remember about A.

Too much Vite A is toxic/harmful. I don't know/remember what dosages were considered safe. However, you can take all the beta carotene you want-- it is not stored in the body. I used to be able to eat raw carrots til my palms were orange. (supposed to help prevent cancer). Now, I hardly eat carrots, but take 3 betacarotenes per day.

I believe that if I'm taking too much, my body won't save or store it.

I stand to be corrected on this -- it's a supplement I have taken for years, but did not continue to research.