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Thinking of going to Hansa...advice

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Posted 4/20/2016 5:38 PM (GMT -5)
I have read everything I could find on Hansa on this forum and online. I am not sure if it is worth going to or not, since very few people seem to get better after treatment there from what I could find. I have symtoms that no one else seems to have. When I herx I get full of inflammation and get bone spurs. I now have them in my neck, back, knee, etc. I know Lyme can mascarade as osteoarthritis, but I have yet to talk to anyone who gets joint damage when they herx. I haven't read of anyone getting help with arthritis at Hansa. I am wondering if the clinic starts herbals as part of the therapy when you start treatment and do you herx with them. I know the herxing is supposed to be gentler at Hansa, but I would like to know what people have experienced. I tend to herx with everything....moducare, folinic acid, LDN, xylitol, magnesium, herbals, antiboitics, etc. Any advice is appreciated. I am desperate to stop the joint destruction.
Posted 4/20/2016 9:05 PM (GMT -5)
I'm so very sorry that you're struggling so much!

I do not feel qualified to advise you on this one but my post bumps your thread and I hope our members with Hansa experience see it.

Good luck with whatever you decide!!!
Posted 4/21/2016 3:59 AM (GMT -5)
Thanks cd3764.
Posted 4/21/2016 11:52 AM (GMT -5)
DMW-We have a user who went to the Hansa center for his daughter. Heathersdad has been a wonderful member of this community.
Here is a link to a thread that he responded to a post for info. If you post in that thread or email him he will respond.

www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3270879

I hope this helps a bit.
Posted 4/21/2016 3:17 PM (GMT -5)
I can't comment on Hansa or bone spurs specifically, but I have had a lot of joint/inflammation issues. I was first diagnosed with Lyme because of knee problems. The MRI showed a big tear in my medial meniscus which needed 2 surgeries to fix. I fractured a vertebra and had pain that lingered for over a decade, despite PT. The pain is now much better and only bothers me if I do a lot of heavy lifting (which I can now do because I'm not in as much pain). I used to have pain, stiffness and swelling in most of my joints, especially my hands. Its now pretty much gone, so long as I take my fish oil and curcumin.

Essential oils can also help, but they can cause a herx. I've been using frankincense, lavender, eucalyptus and chamomile mixed in a carrier oil.

I'm very hypersensitive and just started out on some supportive supplements and 1 drop of Samento (cat's claw tincture) per day. I also did mini-detox baths...warmish water and a couple squirts of peroxide. Starting super low and slow really helped a lot. I've been doing the Buhner protocol + my own customizations for 2 years now, and it is working. Especially for the joint stuff.

Have you been tested for adrenal fatigue, MTHFR/detox mutations or heavy metal toxicity? All those can make detoxing an issue.

Low dose immunotherapy (Dr Ty Vincent) might be something to look into. Its a homeopathic way of helping reset the immune system. Its something my LLND suggested.
Posted 4/21/2016 5:44 PM (GMT -5)
Thanks for your reply sayyanina. I am hypersensitive to most supplements/herbals. I took Samento/Cowden for 8 months and herxed with every drop increase. I developed more bone spurs on the 36 hour pulses. I don't have MTHFR but I have many other gene deficits. I also have mold toxins, and can't find a way to detox the mold. I've tried activated charcoal but it was pulling the cannabutter out too and I was getting all my symptoms back. I have had my adrenals tested and my LLND said I don't have adrenal fatigue.

I have thought about LDI, but I did EPD for chemical sensivities and I didn't find it helped at all. According to my LLND, it's based on the same principal.

I am not sure what I should be doing. How can you get rid of Lyme without herxing? I think I am in a no win situation.
Posted 4/21/2016 8:20 PM (GMT -5)
For mold,have you tried Cholestyramine? It worked well for me. Someone mention Phytosterol complex the other day for mold. You can google it and see the reviews. I'm thinking of trying it.

I hope you receive your answers soon.
Posted 4/22/2016 6:56 AM (GMT -5)
Hi dmw52,

I didn't go to Hansa as I healed using Dr. Jernigan's protocol from his book. I had joint problems, lost the use of my legs (I needed crutches to get around), etc. before I started Jernigan's protocol. It's been over 10 years that I remain totally well! So please don't lose hope okay?

Anyway, I do know many who did go to Hansa and they have their lives back. Did you read about Gary aka GWB and his wife Daisy? There is also Nan777, Heathersdad daughter, and so many more that are doing great. If you want links to their stories I can provide them for you.

I always suggest to people who are thinking of going to Hansa to first read Dr. Jernigan's book "Beating Lyme Disease".. Fascinating book and has so much information.

There are also free video's you can watch to learn what Hansa does:

hansacenter.com/category/lectures/

Dr. Jernigan does not believe a person should suffer while trying to get better (minimal herxing, etc.) and if you do decide to go the doctors there will tailor a protocol for you since everyone is different. I guess I was just plain lucky that his Healing at Home protocol worked for me.

One of the reasons I decided on Dr. J's botanicals was because he grows his own botanicals and then tests them unlike the bottled tinctures one buys online (who knows how and where they are really made?)... Yes, I question everything because I have a very curious mind.

I also let people know that when they return home if they don't continue to detox, eat healthy, address emotional problems, stress, etc. then their chances of healing are not that great. Even though I have been healed for all these years I still continue to detox (detox baths, dry skin brushing, liver/gallbladder cleanses, coffee enemas, etc.) because I believe we live in a toxic world.

If you have any questions please e-mail me okay?

I hope this helps and I wish you the best!
Denise
Posted 4/22/2016 5:08 PM (GMT -5)
Hi dmw, I'm sorry to hear that you feel unwell. I don't know about Hansa, I just wanted to say that I understand you, as I have terrible joint pain that is so debilitating. I hope you will be better soon.
Do you know what is the approximate price of the treatment?
Posted 4/23/2016 3:58 AM (GMT -5)
Thanks for the responses.

Dejavu....I can't seem to tolerate anything that regulates the immune system, and I've read that Dr Jernigan's herbals boost the immune system. I have read all the testimonials that you mentioned, but no one had arthritic symptoms ie joint damage. I have also read the reviews of several people who were not helped at all. The last time I tried minocycline every second day I developed bone spurs in my back and now my back snaps when I move certain ways and my neck sounds like broken sticks....confirmed by xray.

Leilex, I haven't tried Cholestyramine but I when I tried it many years ago for a pregnancy related problem...choleostatic hepatis, I couldn't tolerate it at all. It gave me severe abdominal pain.

Blueberry muffin, the price is about $9000 for two weeks plus hotel and airfare. I am Canadian so I need to add the exchange too.

I went to the rheumatologist yesterday and she said I don't have inflammatory arthritis....joints are swollen, just full of osteophytes. I can't seem to get any help and have even travelled across the country. The LLND I am seeing doesnt' know what to do for me. Everything he tried made me much worse. I am seeing a psychologist next week since I am depressed at times and don't have any hope of ever getting any better. Since I have been treating for 2.5 years, I am getting much worse.
Posted 4/23/2016 10:14 AM (GMT -5)
Hi again dmw52,

Dr. Jernigan's botanicals are NOT designed to boost one's immune system thus what you read is a misconception.

Borrelogen gets rid of lyme bacteria (borrelia burgdorferi) including babesia, ehrichia, rocky mountain spotted fever, etc.

In 1997 Dr. Jernigan had IgeneX test Borrelogen (LUAT Test) where he had his patients take Borrelogen for 3 days and collected their urine.

At that time the test IgeneX used a high positive was 45 (dead lyme bacteria). The data Jernigan collected showed the body dumped the dead Borrelia Burgdorferi at a count of 150 as an average and some people had a high count of 450.

jernigannutraceuticals.com/Borrelogen_long_new.html

The Neuro-Antitox formulas bind up toxins so the body can get rid of them.

As far the immune system is concerned eating healthy, low stress levels, detoxing, etc. boosts the immune system. Taking abx compromises the immune system as well as an unhealthy life style.

Chronic lyme disease and arthritic problems go hand in hand. I believe toxins cause most arthritic problems.

I suggest to focus on the positive stories of people who were healed using Dr. Jernigan's protocol instead of the negative ones. I personally know of only 1 person who said they had a negative experience.

Again, I suggest you buy Dr. Jernigan's book in order to educate yourself. Just going to any clinic without knowing what kind of procedures they do and how they help patients is a waste of money in my opinion. You can gain so much knowledge just by watching Hansa videos as well as reading Dr. Jernigan's blogs.

Denise
Posted 4/23/2016 10:23 AM (GMT -5)
My friend had parathyroid issues and low vitamin d and had bone spurs....just wondering if you have had your parathyroid and vitamin d checked? It may be worth looking into? I believe she has Lyme but is untested and untreated, but has SO many Lyme symptoms.


Jenny
Posted 4/24/2016 4:43 PM (GMT -5)
Deejavu, thanks for the info about Borrelogen. I will download the book and read it.

Jennysetter, interesting about parathryroid and low vit d. I am taking vit d. I've had my calcium levels checked but not parathryoid. I'll look into that.
Posted 4/24/2016 4:52 PM (GMT -5)
For information on Parathyroid - this is a website that I used when my Vit.D levels were low, and my GP tested my Calcium and parathyroid hormone levels.
Of course while waiting for the results...I found this website...and did my research.

There are charts showing what the different test results mean...very helpful.




www.parathyroid.com
Posted 4/24/2016 5:20 PM (GMT -5)
thanks for the link, Girlie. After reading info on the site I dont' think that I have a parathryoid problem. My calcium levels are normal and I had an ultrasound of my thyroid last year. My vit d levels are also within range.
Posted 4/24/2016 6:02 PM (GMT -5)
That's good your calcium and vit.D levels are within range...
Posted 4/25/2016 6:10 AM (GMT -5)
Jennysetter is correct, I'd be looking into a parathyroid issue. I'd also be looking into more than just Lyme. Your body is depositing excessive calcium in places it should not be getting excessive calcium. Why would it do that? It's logical to assume (I know we get into trouble when we assume) that your body is detecting a problem (possibly a pathogen) and is attempting to correct the problem by increasing calcium deposition. Ratios are important in our body and the calcium/magnesium ratio is no different. If I was in your situation, I'd be supplementing magnesium glycinate until my stools became soft. If you are hypersensitive, detoxing should be increased and an attempt to lower histamine formation should be made. It sounds like you have an issue with calcium/magnesium transit through the cell membrane. Although your calcium levels show normal on blood tests, a case could be made that your intracellular levels of calcium in lymphocytes are elevated. Our lymphocytes often do this with other polyvalent cations in an attempt to decrease pathogen growth of intracellular pathogens. Copper is really bad about doing this and an imbalance in copper may lead to bone spurs. I'd be looking hard at this.


I'd be investigating whether acetic acid iontophoresis was a viable option or whether using a TENS unit with 5% acetic acid would be worthwhile. I'd be evaluating my selenium and phosphate levels as each play a vital role in the dynamics of calcium utilization. I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you what I'd be looking to evaluate to try to find out what is wrong.
Posted 4/25/2016 8:21 AM (GMT -5)
Thanks for the advice Georgia. My dr has diagnosed me with diffuse osteo and all my blood work is always normal. I have seen two rheumatologists who have also not helped at all. I can't seem to get any help. I have so much damage in the past 3 yeasrs since I have been sick and it is progressing quickly. It seem to happen mostly when I herx...I can feel the area that is being damaged. I can't even take magnesium, since it causes a flare. I have very high histamine levels.

Is acetic acid iontophoresis something I can buy? I have a Tens machine.

I have saunas most days, drink lemon water, take chlorella, exercise, and am sugar,gluten, dairy free.

What kind of specialist do I try to see?


Thanks again. I wish my dr would think of these thing!!!
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