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Posted 9/20/2016 6:13 PM (GMT -5)
Why is bartonella so darn hard for me to treat!!!

Is it heavy metal toxicity? Or a sluggish immune system? Or problems with me detoxing? Or a combo of all three?

So I regressed in the past few days, I swear missing one dose for bartonella puts me back to square one and then when I take the buhner herbs again it's back to intense painful bartonella herxes.

Only thing I believe I did wrong is miss a couple doses of the buhner herbs and missed my dose of liposomal vitamin C with liposomal glutathione. Those are the only things I did differently that caused me to regress back into bartonella pain. Then i took the double dropper full of sida, alchornea, crypto, and houttuynia, and then like a few hours later back to intense intense pain again.

This Chim Fluox Aviva... I haven't missed a single night time round of this since I have taken it, and I did notice herxing my first few nights and felt very positive to take it. But it seems like it's just a milk sugar pill now. But I will keep taking it though.

I have also been consistent with A-Bart which is another treatment my LLMD recommends.

But you know now? I think the A-bart does absolutely nothing. I take a dropper full of it twice a day and have been consistent with that for the past 2 weeks. Nothing.

So I'm losing hope with A-bart and Chim Fluox Aviva. But I will just continue taking them.

It seems only the woodland essence buhner tinctures are what work for me at this point. Also I believe the liposomal vitamin C has helped as well.

I feel like I'm taking too much stuff.
Posted 9/20/2016 6:17 PM (GMT -5)
The vitamin C is really working to boost that immune system. I think sometimes we may think that things aren't working, but they really are. The only way to truly know is of course is to stop taking them. I ran out of houtt a few days and started feeling more blah....now that I'm back on it...I'm feeling like yes, that's what was missing. And remember some things are synergistic.
Posted 9/20/2016 6:38 PM (GMT -5)
Lymepickle, I haven't missed any doses but after two months of no bone pain and improving energy, I have a week of mild bone pain and bad energy and then cold later to top it off. I think it's not always an upward curve, sometimes we have bad days or weeks. (At least that's what I'm hoping!) like you though, I'm worried I did something wrong or didn't do something right. The self-doubt in all of this kills me sometimes! Keep us updated! I hope you feel better soon!
Posted 9/20/2016 9:24 PM (GMT -5)
I have the same problem LymePickle. I won't miss certain things for several days, but them I forget something else and have a horrible time being consistent. Right now my Buhner herbs are lined up behind my keyboard and I add them in order to my cup, but forget my lip C on the kitchen counter.. :(
Posted 9/21/2016 1:17 AM (GMT -5)
I heard herbs only suppress bart ..as it is intracelluar ..i went 5 to 10 to 20 drops of a bart and not herxing like venom herxes ..gunna try riffy soon...f***** bart

Post Edited (bluelyme) : 9/21/2016 12:29:42 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 9/21/2016 1:30 AM (GMT -5)

bluelyme said...
I heard herbs only suppress bart ..as it is intracelluar ..i went 5 to 10 to 20 drops of a bart and not herxing like venom herxes ..gunna try riffy soon


lol - bluelyme - you keep mentioning trying rifampin soon....

Honestly, I didn't have any issues with it. But, I started low dose for a week or two.
Posted 9/21/2016 3:30 AM (GMT -5)
A-BART did zero for my bart symptoms and i was taking 25 drops 3x/day for a few months. i'm starting to rife BART as well using the most popular 2 frequencies 832 and 1518. got a short herx from 832 today so maybe onto something.

i took 600 mg rifampin daily for 4 months and tolerated it fine. think i'm going to ask the doctor to switch out my current bactrim/biaxin and go with rifamycin/minocycline. rifamycin is a newer rifampin and also hits lyme if its causing issues. mino will hit all sorts of stuff just like doxy.
Posted 9/21/2016 8:56 AM (GMT -5)
Bluelyme. So A-Bart is basically useless right? I think that certain herbs do kill Bart just like abx do. The problem with Bart is like you said intracellular pathogen. And even when immune cells eat it, it can live in immune cells and kill them . Which is why the liposomal vitamin C and liposomal glutathione probably are helping me. That will allow the immune cells to withstand the heavy oxidative stress of killing bartonella.

Krimpet... I think you are right. The lipsomal vitamin C I need to be consistent with. I noticed bad herx the first 3 days I started it then improved. I cannot underestimate the benefits of vitamin C. Dave Asprey of bulletproof recommends high amounts of vitamin C taken daily and consistently for any infection at least until the infection clears. And animals make their own vitamin C which they make more of when they get infections... Which probably explains why in general animals don't get as sick with these infections as people do.

Violet... Ya keep it up. I have experienced the same thing with Bart. Just make sure to keep going and not stop which is so important with Bart! Keep up with probiotics... I had Bart so close to being beat and has like no symptoms and I stopped the abx which is the dumbest thing to do. Each round of treatment failure and Bart becomes more resistant to abx. Well this is the case in the Petri dishes, and in my own experience. I know some argur on here, try "pulsing" for Bart. I think it is bad.

Caramba... Ya I think the lipsomal vit C is so critical! Did you know there is a girl out there that cured her bartonella but when she was just infected and just started having symptoms with lipo C? Also people in the 50s cured their Brucella with vit C But taken over months and months. Brucella and Bart are very similar with similar symptoms.

Rikky.. My first month of treatment I did mino and rifampin but I got much much worse and was worried the disease was regressing. I didn't understand the concept of herxing at the time so I asked to get it changed. I wish I would have just stuck with it! So you also think A-Bart does nothing? I haven't actually found any success stories with A-Bart. And how is rifing for Bart? I tried rifing for Bart and got no reaction.
Posted 9/21/2016 9:02 AM (GMT -5)
LP - Have you tested positive for Bart? What are your main symptoms?

You mention heavy metals, have you been tested or treated for them? What about mold, parasites, etc?
Posted 9/21/2016 9:12 AM (GMT -5)
K07... My Bart diagnosis is clinical. But I am 100% sure I have it and based on symptoms my doctors are 100% sure I got it too. Bart testing is the least accurate of all the infections of Lyme disease. The best testing is galaxy diagnostics but even that can fail, so they have triple draws to try and overcome that issue.

I have tested positive for heavy metals just before I got sick.

Mold... No testing and I doubt I have that as I live in brand new house and in Canada. If I see even a tiny tiny bit of mold on food I throw it in the garbage and don't eat it. Parasites... I had 4 months of tinidazole which hopefully killed most of them. I probably have a few parasites left though in all probability.

My main symptom is foot aches. Bone aches, rashes,... I can go on and on with like 120 symptoms but I don't feel like typing that much. Main issue remaining is bartonella pain issues. The infection remains in my bone and deeper tissues, sometimes I notice recurrent infection in my muscle too, as well as my liver aches occasionally.
Posted 9/21/2016 9:44 AM (GMT -5)
Just curious because it seems like you've treated for awhile. I know the testing is not accurate, just trying to see if maybe you had something else holding you back.

I think we all have metals to some degree. What do your virus levels look like?

As for the mold, it can happen in new houses too. I believe Georgia Hunter mentioned he found it in his AC unit of new home. Depends on how the house was built. I live in a new home too, but I think we may have a mold issue. Our house did smell of mildew until we put a dehumidifier under our house.

There's so many areas to explore with LD/co's. I haven't found an area that has particularly helped me yet (metals, parasites, candida treatment, etc.). The best I felt is when I left my home for 7 weeks and spent a lot of time in the sun.
Posted 9/21/2016 10:20 AM (GMT -5)
>>Mold... No testing and I doubt I have that as I live in brand new house and in Canada

Mold is a yeast. If you are taking abx you may have an overgrowth of Candida which produces mycotoxins same as other molds you would get from a bad environment so it's worth looking into whether you have a mycotoxin issue. I do and my house is fine had it tested using an industrial hygenist. Currently treating the same as you would any other mold toxin issue.

I just started rifing Bart again had a small herx but just started so can't give any feedback yet. Will do it consistently daily and ramp up on those 2 frequencies for a few weeks and see what happens. Lots of trial and error in our world!
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