Here is my Igenix Test - Indeterminate - What to Do ?

Hi Lyme Yes or No? - welcome to our community!

So, when your only two + bands are 31 and 41...Igenex offers to do the epitope test to confirm that band 31 is indeed from Borrelia.

Dr. Horowitz says band 31 is significant...and it RARELY is from something other than borrelia.

You have enough activity on your IgG to be comfortable with a lyme diagnosis.
It all depends on how important it is for you to have a positive instead of an Indeterminate Igenex result.


My husband also had bands 31 and 41 (IGM though) + and he did do the Epitope test...it can back as positive...so it changed his test result to a positive one.

Hi Lyme yes or no!
Welcome to our community! I'm so glad you found us.

Girlie has already given you some really great information, so I just wanted to add a bit more.

You have Lyme - both bands 31 and 39 are considered to be Lyme specific bands. A "Lyme specific band" means specific for Borrelia Burgdorferi, sensu stricto - Lyme disease in the strictest sense. There are only two on the over 300 known strains of Lyme that is considered Bb, ss. Borrelia burgdorferi and Borrelia mayonii. Nothing else will turn a Lyme specific band positive other than Lyme disease - - even though there are over 100 different strains of Borrelia in the US that cause human illness.

For information on finding a​n ILADS ​(International Lyme and Associated Diseases Society)​ trained​ Lyme Literate Medical Doctor(LLMD) in your area, you will need to enable your email option in your profile in order to receive any recommendations, as we don't allow doctor's names and contact info to be posted on the forum for several reasons. You can enable your email option in your profile, under 'edit profile'. Be sure to click the submit button to actually save your preference.


​You can send me an email by clicking on my screen name or the small blue envelope under my screen name. I may have contact information for some LLMD's in your area as well.​ ​Please include your state (or province) and area that you would like to find a LLMD in and I will be happy to share the names I have.​


You can email the Tick-Borne Disease Alliance at medicalinfo@tbdalliance.org​ for LLMD referrals.


You can go to The Lyme Disease Association and search for LLMD's 3 times in a month. You have to register first. Here is the link:
www.lymediseaseassociation.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=277&Itemid=74​​


And www.LymeDoc.org


​ You will want to find a well trained doctor, not one that has self proclaimed themselves as a LLMD or an ID Doc (Infectious Disease Doctor), as ID docs believe Lyme is hard to catch and easy to treat, and don't believe in the reality of chronic Lyme. Go to the ILADS site to read the new (2014) Treatment guidelines to get you started on your healing journey:
www.lymenet.org/BurrGuide200810.pdf

Just dropping by to echo the welcome of everyone in this community and you've already gotten some awesome prompts. Lyme is a clinical diagnosis, with blood work used to back up the clinical diagnosis. If that were my blood work, and I had the symptoms you have, I'd pursue a lyme + co-infection consideration. There was a screening tool developed by a Dr. who has treated thousands of patients, for me, taking this, it was the bit that caused me to begin an herbal approach. Here is the link www.tiredoflyme.com/horowitz-lyme-msids-questionnaire.html. All bands were negative for me with a non-lyme lab, and then two months into treatment, band 41 became ++. I found this great take on band 41. lymemd.blogspot.com/2008/09/all-i-got-was-41band.html Once again, welcome to this community. An awesome group of helpful beings who know a TON!

Igenex stills has my blood sample - so ordered the 489 test last night - to firm up the Indeterminate 189 test that had the 31 + and 41 + bands.

Will post the results in a week or two when they come in.

LymeYN,

This is good news. Please keep us posted on your test results (although we sort of know the answer).

The wait time to see an LLMD is a long one. I called every single day and got in under a month (from being bitten). I was bit in July and given a November appointment. I got in for August. There are always cancelations. Get to know the receptionists name, tell her you can get there even it's a last minute cancellation and then call several times a week. It works.

Well Cancellation worked....appointment is now Dec. 19th - instead of Jan 26th :) So thanks - yes it was a good idea.....

Also - had a band 58 with a single +.... forgot to put that down on my first post.... Not sure if that means much?

Igenex confirmed they have sent the 489 test results to my non Lyme friendly doctor - so will get the receptionist to fax the results to me Monday. Not sure how much information the 489 will give me.... but Igenex already had the blood sample - so why not....

LymeYES,

My husband testing Indeterminate for band 41 and positive for 58. LLMD said that's pretty much lyme. I'm guessing a non-LLMD will say otherwise.

Please update us. Glad you got in sooner.

Lyme Yes or No ?

You did have other 'activity' on your WB - IND 34 and IND 39 - those are lyme specific bands. IND doesn't mean negative...it means it wasn't strong enough for a positive.

Huddie said...
LymeYES,



I have a HW question: Do less bands translate to less sick? Meaning if Lymeyes only has one or two he will heal a lot faster than someone with five-six bands like my son?

No, it's just showing your body's immune system response to the bacteria.

So more bands means your immune system was able to mount a response.
It doesn't mean you are sicker.

If the epitope comes back positive...no further testing needed.

(although I don't think the Epitope is necessary...but I understand wanting a positive rest result)

Mustard Seed said...
I didn't read the whole thread, and I'm sure someone's said this, but bands 34 and 39 are specific for Borrelia Burgdorferi. This is your biggest clue that you're Lyme positive.

Band 34 (Osp B) is actually what they used in the Lyme vaccine, and thus, is not included in certain labs diagnostic evaluation since anyone who got the vaccine will have a positive at 34.

Band 41 is not specific for Borrelia, but is specific for the tail of a spirochete.
Band 31 can potentially cross-react with Band 41, hence the IGENEX isotope test.

band 31 can potentially cross-react with viruses, eg. EBV and the vaccine can cause a positive 31.
Dr. Horowitz says band 31 is in his list - says the virus issue is rare...and thinks the vaccine was so many years ago, he doesn't think it's significant.

So, the epitope is ruling out anything other than Bb causing the positive band.(31)

I have not heard of band 31 cross-reacting with band 41 before...

Girlie said...

Mustard Seed said...
I didn't read the whole thread, and I'm sure someone's said this, but bands 34 and 39 are specific for Borrelia Burgdorferi. This is your biggest clue that you're Lyme positive.

Band 34 (Osp B) is actually what they used in the Lyme vaccine, and thus, is not included in certain labs diagnostic evaluation since anyone who got the vaccine will have a positive at 34.

Band 41 is not specific for Borrelia, but is specific for the tail of a spirochete.
Band 31 can potentially cross-react with Band 41, hence the IGENEX isotope test.

band 31 can potentially cross-react with viruses, eg. EBV and the vaccine can cause a positive 31.
Dr. Horowitz says band 31 is in his list - says the virus issue is rare...and thinks the vaccine was so many years ago, he doesn't think it's significant.

So, the epitope is ruling out anything other than Bb causing the positive band.(31)

I have not heard of band 31 cross-reacting with band 41 before...

I agree. I'm lyme positive on the IFA and then also had 31 and 41. So it's further data/evidence that 31 and 41 (especially a combo of the two) is a very high probability of lyme. I agree with the rarity that it's something else.

Couple this with symptoms of the original poster then it's pretty much guaranteed. Looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and you know how the rest goes.