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Posted 5/3/2017 6:27 AM (GMT -5)
Hi friends,

I've been hearing about Milk Thistle a lot lately and am looking for some more info. What exactly do people use it for? Does it help with detoxing? Does it have to be taken while on antibiotics? Any side effects? Thanks for reading. smile
Posted 5/3/2017 7:32 AM (GMT -5)
I need to know more info about it also. I know in Buhner's book, he says to take Milk Thistle Seed, standardized. If I remember correctly, it's to help detox the liver. I just think I may be taking the wrong thing.
Posted 5/3/2017 8:21 AM (GMT -5)
Hey, there's plenty on here if you search. It detoxes the liver. You can take pills--or I grind the seeds and put them in food or use them for a tea. They can interfere with other antibiotics, like Rifampin, so search on here about that.
Posted 5/3/2017 8:26 AM (GMT -5)
If anything, just try to space it far away from ABX--should be fine.
Posted 5/3/2017 8:34 AM (GMT -5)
I don't believe it interferes with any of the herbs, but that would be something to check as well.
Posted 5/3/2017 9:01 AM (GMT -5)
I have been curious about it as well. I went to my acupuncturist last week, who detected some liver "sluggishness," although all my blood tests are fine (my LLMD does blood tests every 2 months while on abx). She suggested Desiccated Liver and/or Ox Bile, but wanted to me run it my my LLMD first. I'd never heard of either of them. LLMD said both were fine to try. So I'm trying the Desiccated Liver, at least first, per my acupuncturist. I just ordered it, and it should be here on Friday.

My acupuncturist (who is AMAZING and far more knowledgeable than most doctors I know), said it would help support my liver and make it more efficient, thus (hopefully) making my detox efforts more effective. We'll see.

I already take WP Thyroid for hypothyroidism. It's a prescription, but it is desiccated Thyroid. This is the same thing, just for your liver. It's also sold as a supplement, so not prescription.

Oh, and I don't think it interferes with meds, because it's basically just freeze dried cow liver.
Posted 5/3/2017 11:29 AM (GMT -5)
I read you are not supposed to take Milk Thistle if you are allergic to Ragweed, because it's from the same family. You can look further into how severe that cross-reaction is, but I know my allergies go nuts when the ragweed is high, so I don't touch the stuff, though it's often recommended for detox.
Posted 5/3/2017 11:46 AM (GMT -5)
I'm one of those too, Babsbunny, so I use an all natural liver/gall bladder detox regularly. For those that can't use milk thistle, you need to find other ways to deal with the build up of toxins in the liver that can happen.

For those with only a minor ragweed allergy, my suggestion is to give milk thistle a try, but if you have a moderate or serious allergy to ragweed, then consider other options.
Posted 5/3/2017 12:43 PM (GMT -5)
Is there a brand anyone could suggest or would bulk powder be ok?
Posted 5/3/2017 12:57 PM (GMT -5)
Just be sure it's from a good, reputable company. You don't want it to be filled with fillers and/or contaminated is all.
Posted 5/3/2017 2:14 PM (GMT -5)
I found starwest botanicals organic powder, but I don't know what standardized means, and it doesn't say.
Posted 5/3/2017 2:19 PM (GMT -5)
I have been taking Swanson's Superior Herb Combination, and it does say standardized but low dose and has other herbs in it. Buhner says to take 1200mg daily. I've only been taking two of these a day.

Milk Thistle Seed Extract 175 mg * (standardized to 80% silymarin)
Dandelion Root 85 mg *
Black Radish Root 60 mg *
Burdock Root 60 mg *
Ginger Root 60 mg *
Parsley Leaf 35 mg
Posted 5/3/2017 5:01 PM (GMT -5)
I've searched a bit through this forum, but I can't find a definitive answer.

Should we be taking milk thistle (a P450 inhibitor) with rifampin (a P450 inducer)?

This article summarises the overall research: Natural medicines Comprehensive Database: MILK THISTLE And it says the research is conflicting (and it doesn't mention rifampin).

Googling found this: Milk Thistle - WARNING.

We're doing the Buhner protocol for Bartonella. Our doctor recently put us on antibiotics: rifampin, doxy, and azithromycin. Some good solid herxing on the herbs (sida acuta was very challenging) and on azithromycin.

Buhner said that it's okay to keep doing the herbs while on abx, so we had just gone with that.

And here is a nice explanation of what happens when you combine and inhibitor with an inducer:
Enzyme Inducer Plus Enzyme Inhibitor: What Will Happen?

Cytochrome P450 drug interactions: are they clinically relevant?

Which suggests the main effect of MT could be to slow down the metabolism of rifampin and increase its peak serum concentration.

But it depends on the mode of action. "For drugs whose pharmacological activity requires biotransformation from a pro-drug form, inhibition can lead to decreased efficacy.

But then you google through pubmed and get contradictory reports from trials in test tubes and in humans:
These articles say it should be okay, I think:
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1865122/
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4164972/
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25028567

This article says that MT can be a strong inhibitor: /www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23801821

Post Edited (ccc-better) : 5/3/2017 4:55:29 PM (GMT-6)

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