Disulfiram Permanent Side Effects? - Floxxed Similarities or Actually Bartonella?

I've been reading a lot of horror stories popping up on the Disulfiram group, I hope many are noticing what happens when you go too fast with this drug...

My personal thoughts are, what these patients are describing aren't the side effects of the drug, similar to being floxxed with a fluoroquinolone like Cirpo, but actually bartonella flaring and it's causing some very very very scary symptoms. Reading this patients story down below, I think this patient doesn't realize intrusive thoughts are related to bartonella nor does he understand the flaring from bartonella can effect your vision and even cause that paresthesia he's having with his muscle and joints. And the brain burning he's describing is actually neuropathy from too much herxing.

I think the only way to reverse the bartonella flaring is going on bartonella specific antibiotics low and slow something like bactrim+rifampin or bactrim+omnicef... Along with supplements such as Kal's Magnesium Glycinate to ease his anxiety and intrusive thoughts, along with warm(not hot) epsom salt baths... I'm sure Turmeric will help with the brain neuropathy.

His French Doctor supposedly gave him full dosage at 500mg a day, yikes...

I mean maybe there are some permanent side effects from taking Disulfiram, but so far alcoholics do not go through neuropathy that lyme patients are experiencing with this drug and you know what coinfection causes neurpathy the most, B-A-R-T-O-N-E-L-L-A....

My personal feelings after dealing with bartonella myself, I was getting nowhere just by going super hard with 3 antibiotics at a time or even a biofilm buster like oregnano oil with bactrim+rifampin. Just going slow with bactrim+omnicef was making my bartonella symptoms lower, I suspect this is probably the best way with with Disulfiram for treating Bartonella. What is Dr. K recommending, 62.5mg of Disulfiram a day? Just do that... I've heard he even recommends beginners starting off with 62.6mg every 3 days, yes that's how strong this drugs is.

I think it's very likely tha Disulifram targets borrelia and babesia efficiently enough where it makes fighting Bartonella a lot easier, especially since you'll be raising your immune system by not killing off any of your microbiome and at the same time lowering autoimmunity, which is basically healing the gut! I think in the long run this may be how bartonella should be put in remission, rather than just kill-kill-kill tactic, anyways, just a theory of mine. Because I'm starting to see some lyme patients with bartonella have successful results with Disulfiram, as this one lady Brittany shared recently on the Beating Bartonella group how much Disulfiram has changed her life!!! Again, she had bartonella!!!

https://www.facebook.com/brittany.goff.90/posts/1475891765901523

Brittany said...

I am no longer living daily with neurological complications such as brain fog, memory loss, loss of speech, difficulty finding words, pins and needle feeling through my arms, numbness in my legs, facial twitching, light sensitive, noise sensitivity, night sweats, air hunger, fatigue, stiff neck, fevers, chills, shooting/stabbing pains, depersonalization, feeling like my brain was burning or on fire, Insomnia, and vision complication. All of the symptoms have been completely cleared up by Antabuse. I am finally getting my life back again and I am so grateful.

I think this goes back to a little about autoimmunity and how treating this disease shouldn't being about kill, kill, kill... But targetting persister cells and coinfections at a slow pace without harming the microbiome, while at the same time raising your immune system and lowering autoimmunity at the same time. And as I remarked to dcd2103 about his post about chronic lyme being autoimmune. This new drug Disulifram seems to target everything, as it's both antibacterial and antiparasitic, while also keeping the microbiome healthy without killing any good culture/probiotics in your gut.

I suspect what Dr. Kim Lewis has been saying about autoimmunity being linked to an imbalanced microbiome has been right from day one. However, without a doubt there's a persistent infection at hand due to persister cells. It seems to me if you heal your gut, it will make fighting borrelia and it's coinfections a lot easier, including viruses which some lyme patients probably are dealing with too. But remember, disulfiram's history has shown it also targets persister cells.

Dr. Rajadas said this drug may win the molecule of the year award for it's multi-use, which it's shown it's working on cancer as well, along with AIDs. Amazing how a drug like disulfiram has been on the market since day one since the first lyme case in conneticut 40 years ago...

If you notice though, one of the first breakthroughs with chronic lyme was with Flagyl decades ago, some lyme patients got out of their wheel chairs on this drug. I'm not a chemist, but I suspect there's has to be very similar chemical structures of flagyl and disulfiram. As both are antibacterial and parasitic, both are used for alcoholics, coincidence? Highly doubtful, both drugs must do similar things that's why they make them so useful.

Flagyl was reported to target round body forms per Dr. Sapi's work, aka dormant persister cells, what if disulfiram is like flagyl on steroids? lol Funny comparison, but after seeing the neuropathy and extreme herxes lyme patients are getting, it sure seems that way. Go low and slow, please, for your safety and others after reading this story...

Facebook Member on Disulfiram for Lyme Support Group (Antabuse) said...


Hello !

I contact you because of the overdose (500mg) made by my French doctor, to help me because of my severe condition caused by disulfiram. Today, more than two months after discontinuation of disulfiram, I still have symptoms, I am desperate, I don't know what to do , I care about the mind, I cry every day because I have the conviction in me that I'm screwed, that it will never leave. I have dark thoughts, suicide, that a few days of Christmas, my birthday... My mother is too desperate.

Symptoms:

- I have inflammation of the brain and muscles / joints + eyes at times

- When I shake my head from left to right, it feels like a heavy brain, like a sawing noise and when I turn my head just to the right, it makes a tearing noise in my head (it scares me a lot it). When I shake my head too, I have a sound coming out of my ear; when I blink my eyes, I hear the sound of the blink of my eyes; when I open big and close my mouth, I also hear a sound in my ear. There is necessarily a link with all this, it is not normal. Is it due to brain inflammation? For me, there is no doubt, it is the toxicity of disulfiram which is the cause of all that.

Gabbapentin has reduced my brain inflammation but not totally ... The detox doesn't work.

The FFMVT (french federation of tick vector disease) gathering the best Lyme doctors in France as well as patients associations etc talked about my case with disulfiram and they don't understand why the disulfiram acted like that at this dose of 500mg which for them, basic, is safe and so they don't know what to do to help me fix it, to get better ...

I'm 22 years old, I've always fought with my mind against Lyme, hoping for better days, hoping to get back to my condition before this disease and there, I’ve been added something over Lyme and I want to give up, I don't have the strength to fight, I have been fighting against this toxicity for more than two months and in January, I will be fighting against Lyme for 6 years...

PS: Sorry if my English is not perfect, I just hope it is understandable, I use a translator to help me.Looking forward to your doctor's answer"

I think about out of all the 104 patients that commented, 10% recognized these symptoms similar to bartonella.

And obviously the French Doctor that gave him Disulfiram doesn't realize bartonella can lie dormant, then after you put babesia in remission, it can basically flare like you've released the Kraken. I honestly think this is the perfect analogy because I went through this myself.
https://youtu.be/38ayengjqg0?t=36

Bartonella Suicide is a very scary thing, my personal thoughts are that this coinfection is responsible for a lot of lyme suicides, as well as other people probably being hurt after reading these two articles.

"Psychiatrists and Bartonella Stole My Son’s Life"
https://catchingkim.com/2019/06/26/psychiatrists-and-bartonella-stole-my-sons-life/

"Teenager caught a mind-altering infection from his cat, started believing he was the 'son of the devil' and having suicidal thoughts"
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-6830521/suicidal-teenager-hospitalised-schizophrenia-actually-infected-cat-scratches.html

said...

I have dark thoughts, suicide, that a few days of Christmas, my birthday... My mother is too desperate.

I'm sure you see the similarities what you read in this lyme patient's facebook post to the daily mail article.

Low and slow with Disulfiram ok? There's no rush...

And the reason I compare it to being Floxxed, as there's a few members on there like Sebreg who both him and I think the reason some people, not even lyme patients are having longterm neurological effects from the fluoroquinolones is they could very well just be activating bartonella, and once bartonella is out, once the "Genie out of the Bottle," and you don't have the specific bartonella antibiotics to put the Genie back in, you and your Doctor don't realize what's causing your neurological problems, and you both think the neuro symptoms are side effects from the drug? The end result is not good... Going back to this article...

"Psychiatrists and Bartonella Stole My Son’s Life"
https://catchingkim.com/2019/06/26/psychiatrists-and-bartonella-stole-my-sons-life/

What did Ed Breitschwerdt say who's been studying Bartonella for 30 years?

https://www.northcarolinahealthnews.org/2013/12/05/bartonella-is-everywhere-so-why-dont-we-know-more-about-it/

NorthCarolinaHealthNews.org said...
Breitschwerdt said he’s convinced that Bartonella is the stealth cause of many neurological, inflammatory and chronic diseases in humans.

But hey, maybe I'm wrong, without a doubt there's permanent side effects from the fluoroquinolones, maybe there can be with disulfiram as well. Regardless if this is bartonella or side effects from the drugs, take it low and slow. We know a drug like disulfiram kills lyme and its coinfections like no other drug on the market. Dr. H from New York stated that Dapsone used to be his biggest oral herxing drug, now Disulfiram has took over the number one spot. So the biggest herxing drugs for lyme as claimed by Dr. H is #1 Disulfiram and then #2 Dapsone.

Post Edited (Charlie55) : 12/15/2019 12:47:59 PM (GMT-7)

Also many alcoholics have been on full doses of DSF for the last 50 years and they don't report these kind of side effects, so that makes me suspect its a coinfection going wild and not the DSF

S.O.T.?

Lapis- Supportive oligonucleotide therapy. It's a one-time infusion of mRNA synthetic molecules that stops the replication of Borrelia or whatever it's made for. The clinic you're working with sends your blood to a lab in Greece which finds the genetic sequences Borrelia uses to replicate and alters it so it can't. Supposedly the Borrelia dies off in its normal life cycle which is around 80 days though I'm not sure where they came up with that number. They have been doing this for cancer for many years but with Lyme only about 3 so it's still very new.

dcd2103- Testing isn't very accurate but neuropathy can also be from Lyme. I believe mine is after experimenting with different abx and herbs and seeing what hits it. I don't feel I have any of the other typical Bart symptoms.

dcd2103 said...
How accurate are the bartonella tests? Are they just as garbage as the bb? I’ve always tested negative, but my chief complaint IS neuropathy. Also do you think once the bartonella flares on disulfiram that the odds of getting a positive test result are higher?

Yes, just as innacurate as borrelia, if not worse. I've heard Igenex has a very improved test though... This was just in the news last year.

"IGeneX Inc. Introduces Newly Developed, Highly Sensitive Tests For Rapid Diagnosis of Bartonella Infections"
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20181030005288/en/igenex-introduces-newly-developed-highly-sensitive-tests

I suspect if you took some thing like disulfiram, chancing of building of antibodies for bartonella and showing a positive test goes up tremendously.

dcd2103 that one video I sent you of Dr. H's presentation, the lyme patient didn't improve on anything until she took pyrazinamide, that's exactly what happen to her in order to test positive. Her body and bartonella finally responded to the drug pyrazinamide and her bartonella text came back positive after being negative for years, listen to the specifics of what Dr. H says in the presentation... To me this shows how much of a difference there is to a persister cell drug like pyrazinamide versus bactrim+rifampin or biaxin or omnief...
https://youtu.be/bzu0weofvm8?t=5980

Lapis_29 said...
I have a theory that different pathogens sort of hold other co infections in check to a certain extent.

And when you effectively treat one or more pathogens, suddenly that gives room for another pathogen that you have not treated to just go crazy and proliferate like mad because you removed the things holding it in check.

Yes and yes!!!! You're right on the money with that theory Lapis_29, that's exactly what happened to me. And the lady runs the Babesia group on Facebook, Pamela, says the same thing as well. Babesia keeps bartonella dormant, once you knock back Babesia, bartonella flares.

Bartonella lies dormant for the most part in general... Like Dr. Hirsh said here, there's some who don't have lyme and all it takes is a stressful event to happen like a car crash and it flares up their bartonella. They think they're suffering PTSD symptoms from the car crash because of their psych symptoms, nope, it's actually just bartonella. Some people get worse and worse without even knowing what's causing their neurological problems, it's scary.
Dr. Hirsh on Car Crash and Bartonella -> https://youtu.be/tgjjtdapfdi?t=574

After I hit Babesia hard with primaquine and chloroquine, then following up with 3-4 months of csa formula and a-bab. Then when I took iodine/Kelp and selenium/Brazo Nuts, the iodine fully activated my bartonella. I had thought I was losing my mind up above like this individual... The anxiety came on slow and increased week to week, then came the intrusive thoughts, and I was almost hallucinating, then I realized what the hell was going on. Bartonella will also fool your mind into thinking something else is going on...

Soon as I went on bactrim and omnicef, my body responded quickly and I got better. Now a lot of those symptoms have decreased. My personal opinion is I think going low and slow with disulfiram would be a better option for trying to reach remission.

Lapis_29 said...

so in this case you have a person with BB, babs and bart. DSF treats BB and babs, but not bart. So you remove the BB and babs that was keeping the bart in check and now bart is going hog wild and proliferating like mad. So you think its the DSF when its just the bart that the DSF allowed to get out of jail so to speak.

If you listen to what Dr. K has to say in this video, he said in his "clinical experience is that Disulfiram does hit bartonella."
https://youtu.be/q6dlpvbuxrq

My thoughts are the problem some lyme patients are having with flaring is they're going to large of dosages to fast, that's why bartonella is flaring and it seems like DSF isn't treating bartonella. I'd say it's comparable to using three antibiotic at once... I've tried that before and you really just get nowhere pretty fast, you're most likely end up in the hospital due to herxing/flaring than actually putting bartonella in remisison.

And my thought process is, Disulfiram doesn't have to hit bartonella hard if it targets babesia and borrelia hard, as long as Disulfiram is slowing targeting those tick pathogens, it's bringing down the infection level, along with repairing your microbiome and autoimmunity, this in return will make bartonella a lot more easier in putting in remission. I suspect this is Dr. Kim Lewis's theory as well, but don't quote me on that...

My suspicion some of these lyme patients that have reached remission with disulfiram did have bartonella, but the reason they're bartonella hasn't flared is they went low and slow. And if there's no way of getting passed bartonella using 62.5mg, as Dr. K put it, you can always add in 1 pill of Rifampin a day to target the Bartonella. I think Dr. H from New York also said Rifampin isn't hard on the microbiome so that's a big benefit.

Lapis_29 said...
Also many alcoholics have been on full doses of DSF for the last 50 years and they don't report these kind of side effects, so that makes me suspect its a coinfection going wild and not the DSF

Yep, I concur, I think what lyme patients are experience are flaring from a coinfection like bartonella or BLO, even maybe other coinfections...

Sadly this individual and his French doctor up above thinks something like gabapentin is going to control his neuropathy and psyh symptoms. Now that he's flared up bartonella, only way of putting the Genie back in the bottle is treating with bartonella specific antibiotics, if he doesn't the psych symptoms are most likely going to get worse and worse.

There's another person that said he has a friend suffering from vision loss and is permanently disabled from Disulfiram...

said...


I just want to inform fellow Lyme fighters on DSF. I spoke to a friend yesterday who is permanently disabled from DSF. She spent a month in hospital and is now bed bound with nerve damage. Loss of vision, bladder control, legs, swallow, cognitive issues. On suicide watch.

She was urged to keep going to 500 mg by her practitioners. In hindsight she was experiencing nerve damage from week 3 but she continued another 12 weeks increasing.

She warned me particularly about stomach pain and diaphragm area in the beginning. I’m just giving a heads up to be vigilant and trust your instincts. if you get CNS changes that is something you haven’t experienced with any other treatments then consider taking a break.

A lot of her damage actually peaked a few days after stopping so it does stick around. She only got up to 500 mg for a week or two. She was only 55 kg. No support supplements.
She is not an isolated case either.

You know what coinfection can cause you to go blind and cause vision loss? B-A-R-T-O-N-E-L-L-A.

It's insane that very few people aren't realizing that these lyme patients symptoms are from Bartonella, even their Dcotors aren't realazing this is maybe Bartonella.

But hey, maybe they did go too quick and way too high of dosage and they have caused some serious nerve damage and neuropathy...

However, even if they caused nerve damage, Bartonella could still be flaring, again, the only way of putting the genie back in the bottle is going low and slow with something like bactrim+rifampin or bactrim+biaxin or bactrim+omnicef.

I'm going to send this blog post to both of these lyme patients through private message on Facebook, I hope they read it, it may save their life from bartonella.

dcd2103 said...
I’ve always tested negative, but my chief complaint IS neuropathy.

Sounds like you have Bartonella my friend if you're suffering from neuropathy and have exercise intolerance.

Try going on bactrim+rifampin or bactrim+biaxin or bactrim+omnicef, see how you respond to these antibiotics.

And if you do start herxing like an increase in anxiety, twitching, pinching in the head, electrical shocks in feet, and even herxing can cause heart palpitations in the morning, you have your answer what you got...

For whatever reason, when I herx bad with bartonella, I get an increase in anxiety, heart racing, and twitching in my muscles. When the herxing gets super bad, thats when the brain pinching starts to happen. The next day I feel quite revealed though and feel great.

This is turning out to be an amazing post, thank you everyone for chiming in!

Post Edited (Charlie55) : 12/15/2019 12:48:21 PM (GMT-7)

Ok I just sent this specific post through FB private message to the two lyme patients suffering from disulfiram treatment...

Man you all worry me, some us Lyme Veterans have to keep a watch on you guys, lol.

Lapis_29 what does that period mean? lol

Read this post from the disulfiram facebook group, sounds like this lyme patient is purely struggling with bartonella symptoms. She had a breakthrough with dapsone and pyrazinamide which dropped her bartonella anxiety symptoms, but they came back. Sounds like she's treating with Dr. H from New York, I think that's the only LLMD that would give out those two drugs.

What has really seem to help her most as she reported and made her bart pysch symptoms disappear was 62.5mg a day with disulfiram, HINT HINT!

Sounds to me we're getting very close to a lyme cure with this drug, which will treat all the major coinfections low and slow with time, along with repairing your imbalanced microbiome and healing the gut...

I have hope I never seen before in the 9 years of treating this disease!!!

Very exciting times we're living in, very.... I suspect this drug and what has happened with chronic lyme is going to change the medical industry once the truth comes out, especially it showing how wrong the IDSA Doctors were about this disease. I suspect it's going to be a very long process though...

said...


I apologize for not being regular with my posts. Started Disulfiram in June when this group just started. I first experienced neuropathy from treating Lyme with Rifampin July through October 2018.

I have had Lyme since being bitten by thirty to forty nymphs ( literally had at least a hundred or more on me in 2007. Two weeks antibiotics right away. Major psych issues in 2007-2008 . Psych hospital in Jan. 2008Was bitten by a single tick in 2009 and my symptoms went off the chart. Six weeks of antibiotics then with steroids. Reactivated Epstein Barr Virus reared it’s head in 2010-2017 maybe 18.

I’ve been on antibiotics several times a year since 2010.

I have had every symptom imaginable except visual hallucinations.

In 2016 after a wreck , death and assault, my lyme anxiety went from manageable anxiety to (feeling like) my children were being burned alive and I couldn’t get to them. That’s when I reached absolute hell .

In November of 2016 I started aggressively treating Lyme and have been on some form of Antibiotics or Herbs since.

November 2016 I started with P73 Oil of oregano and cyst busters and probiotics . First loss of any Lyme and coinfections symptoms was with Oil of oregano, but i kept hitting hell herxes and then took a few weeks off then switched to antibiotics three months , two weeks off , then herbals.

My routine has basically been that . Herbals three months, break two weeks then antibiotics three months. Break two weeks and also every Saturday and Sunday off as well .

I don’t really have much memory from October 2016 or any of the year 2017.

But I’ll look at the antibiotics I took in 2017.

Anytime I’ve treated effectively there has always been a sense of neuropathy during a herx , but only during the herx and then gone.

Fast forward to Rifampin in July 2018 - October 2018 by November 2018 I had full blown neuropathy from head to toe. But my anxiety went from (feeling like) my kids were being burned alive and not being able to get to them, to feeling like my kids are in a house on fire , but the fire department is bringing them out.

After Rifampin , I did more herbals through December.

January 2019 I did the high dose Dapsone/ Pyrazinamide combination till maybe First of May. This dropped my anxiety to about (feeling like) getting pulled over for speeding .

The anxiety I mentioned after the wreck, up to this point, was 24/7 and I was only able to sleep, at most, two hours at a time.

By the end of using Dapsone and Pyrazinamide, they gave me back my ability to sleep and almost normal anxiety. And the first little sign of my neuropathy improving.

😊

June 2019 I started Disulfiram and this is how I did:

First two or three days I took 500mg called dr ,because I was on fire with it and then dropped down to 250mg for about a month hit bad herx took a week break, because of Holiday ( vacation) in July and started back on 125 mg till August hit bad herx, took a week off in August due to another vacation. Started back and stayed at 125mg till I believe October when I posted about putting the Disulfiram in the enteric capsules .

I did Disulfiram in enteric capsules at to high a dose and broke it down to 62.5 for two or three weeks and hit hell sometime in November and then stopped altogether.

Almost all my symptoms are gone, my anxiety/ptsd is manageable now. Most my lyme and coinfections symptoms are gone or turned down to a whisper,except neuropathy that comes and goes.

100mgs gaba pentin helps me , or 25 mg Benadryl, or 50mgs of hydroxizine . Two to four times a day seems to help, I don’t take all three. Or cannibis. CBD oils helped very little.

At one point after I first got neuropathy in 2018 for at least six months I could take all three above with cannibis and it still not put the fire out. That was the worst experience of my life ( Rifampin)

Now I can take anyone of those four and I’m good . Some days I don’t need anything.

I have switched to a garlic oil tablet 500 mg twice a day .

Still on 1400mg of Milk Thistle twice a day and other detox’s and supplements.

It’s been a little more than one week since I stopped Disulfiram and all last week I was out and about or home cleaning . The neuropathy still gets to me but I haven’t had a truly good week where my head was this clear, hardly any joint pain since 2007.

Hope this wasn’t to long. And I hope this means remission.

I have been,practically , on every antibiotic for Lyme except maybe two at some time or other and every herbal protocol and I still think Disulfiram and the prior Dapsone/Pyrazinamide helped me most.

Did you see this coment "In 2016 after a wreck , death and assault..." This goes back to what Dr. Hirsch said about Bartonella activated and flaring after a stressful event

Bartonella -> https://youtu.be/tgjjtdapfdi?t=574

Like clockwork my friends lol

https://youtu.be/8copz0yqghu?t=1050
My personal opinion is, the lyme patient that Dr Kenneth Liegner said had all the psych symptoms and was on some major psych drugs, then after going on Disulfiram they all went away... Guess what that was, lol, most likely B-A-R-T-O-N-E-L-L-A...

I'd say it's starting to add up folks, at least in my head. And it's quite obvious to me, while others think Disulfiram won't treat Bartonella, it definitely does. Low and slow... You go too high of dosages and fast, it's just going to cause the coinfection to flare and reactivate itself. Remind you the point of Disulfiram isn't to kill, kill, kill, but repair the immune system by repairing the gut and slowly lower the infection load, which is Bartonella, so your immune system can take over and reach remission.

Bartonella is not the type of coinfection you reach remission by unleashing a nuclear weapon onto another nuclear weapon, it's disarmed by sneaking in the back door and pulling out the plugs from underneath, which means healing the gut, eradicating things like SIBO, healing the immune system and slowly killing off babesia and borrelia, which will weaken bartonella, lowering the infection load and then targeting bartonella persisters. Surprisingly enough, just low dose Disulfiram should be able to do this all of this... I think using heavy dose of probiotics and a good diet may speed things up though. You do not throw a nuclear weapon onto another nuclear weapon which just results in a huge explosion, which seems to be happening with bartonella everytime you go after it with high dosage.

said...


I did Disulfiram in enteric capsules at to high a dose and broke it down to 62.5 for two or three weeks and hit hell sometime in November and then stopped altogether.

Almost all my symptoms are gone, my anxiety/ptsd is manageable now. Most my lyme and coinfections symptoms are gone or turned down to a whisper,except neuropathy that comes and goes.

My personal opinion is that we may not even have to go up to 250mg a day, 62.5 may be enough for a lot of us to reach remission with this drug. Remember, it also builds up in your system due to the super long half life, there's probably no need to ramp up to 250mg.

Disulfiram
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/disulfiram
half-life‎: ‎60–120 hours

Doxy
half-life: 18 hours

Post Edited (Charlie55) : 12/15/2019 1:03:20 PM (GMT-7)

Charlie55, i see that you want to help and warn about bartonella, but if you please allow me to say, about neuropathy ..., even alchoolics on Disulfiram get neuropathy and it can hit hard. There are a few case reports about it.

Disulfiram can change the chemical balance of glutamate, it even increases it, according to a few studies, and glutamate is excitoxic.

The horror stories can be about real damage this drug can cause and people confuse it with herx. Everything that happens with this drug cannot be always a herx. Just saying. We must wait for more research, DSF is not the magic bullet everyone things it is, and it can be a jump from a cliff to an abyss... Im am not joking, there is still lack of research about the long term effects on this drug. There are alternatives.

DSF can cause excitoxicity by glutamate uptake in the brain, at least on this there is research about it, and i tell you, the damage DSF can do... isnt from bartonella...

And about JovaLyme, i read his posts, and from what he told and happened, he did had neuropathy from DSF, not bart.

Post Edited (isitlyme) : 12/15/2019 3:14:29 PM (GMT-7)

"Are these all of a sudden these new symptoms that have flared side effects of Disulfiram just from being on this drug for such a short period of time?"

Yes, as with all psych drugs. And they can be quite severe. Thats because i am saying DSF is still a shoot in the dark. Im not saying it doesnt work, it can, but the euphoria that DSF is causing all over the net and forums, blinds many in seeing the Dark Side of the DSF. The adverse effects can appear soon after taking the drug, and also after long term and the worst of it... They can persist. So i am just warning all, be carefull with this drug, its not what everyone thinks it is. Not trying to discourage, but at least give a thought on the harm it can do, not only the good. Also, i would not be confortable at all with any drug that stays on our system tons of hours before clearing out.. specially drugs that can harm. Let me give you just a simple and one of many results from this drug..

https://jnnp.bmj.com/content/jnnp/55/10/925.full.pdf

"Three cases of disulfiram induced Parkinsonism and frontal lobe-like syndrome associated with bilateral lesions of the lentiform nuclei on CT scan are reported. Symptoms developed either after an acute high dose of disulfiram (one case) or after several days to weeks of disulfiram treatment (two cases) and persisted over several years in two patients. These observations suggest that basal ganglia are one of the major targets of disulfiram neurotoxicity. The mechanisms of the lesions of basal ganglia may involve carbon disulfide toxicity."

"but you have to be careful who and what you blame for all your side effects. What's nice about DSF is it's one pill that does so much, rather than 2 or 3 antibiotics at a time."

Charlie, im not blaming anyone. I am just warning what the drug can do. The decision is for everyone to make. Since i read some members here being harmed by it, i gaved up trying it, even more after finding research about its harms. My doctor suggested it but also warned me that people with candidiasis, heart problems and using benzos could not take it, plus a ton of food restrictions and lots of things we put in our mouth wish we not know if it can have a severe reaction from DSF. I recognize that, perhaps even me, one day, can take it, if i am out of options, desperate and about to collapse with no hope. But for now, the risk i have seen from it, is not worth it.

Charlie, honestly, if there are 5000+ taking disulfiram and if even a good part of them would have success in it, like 1000, and i am being too generous with that number, would we knew that by now?

How many are reporting success, do you have an idea?

And when i mean success, i dont mean symptom reduction, because thats what most people get on abx and when they stop abx everything starts again.

For me hearing someone say, "i was on 10 years+ abx, and feeling better like i never felt just from two weeks of DSF". He might be right, but the problem here is, its only symptom reduction, nothing else.

You seem to have an idea how many are taking it. Well what is the value of that?

Thats because its better to wait and see. Perhaps you are right and it will be a great success, or then a great dissapointment like dapsone was, in the end it worked only for some people, and dont forget the power of placebo, the euphoria from Liegner cases will cause a powerfull placebo just by taking one pill, i have seen users in disulfiram forums saying since the first pill, "hey my mind is clearer, i feel less brain fog"

I hope you can share some complete success stories, that would be great. Couple of cases or work in progress cases with symptom reduction is nothing more than what is already happening in the abx community.

Post Edited (isitlyme) : 12/17/2019 10:28:31 PM (GMT-7)

Charlie55 said...
What happened to that Jova Lyme dude from Australia/UK? Looks like he changed his named to Cignet...

Well Cignet, I know you said disulfiram didn't have much affect for your chronic lyme... But here's the thing, in order to take you out of that chronic autoimmune state, it's going to take some time. I recommend getting back on 62.5mg a day and let it do it's magic. It may take a few months to see some progress, but I'm sure eventually you'll see some light at the end of the tunnel.

Remember you're not only fighting underlying multi-infections, even some that are laying dormant like bartonella, but you're also trying to repair autoimmunity, which is most likely caused by an imbalanced microbiome, SIBO, and a tore up gut. It's going to take time!!! Dieting, cutting out carbs and sugar, along with probiotics should speed up the progress of Disulfiram.

That was another user who's account has been deleted. I'm taking a break and using buhner's herbs for now, at an increased dose.