EBV in the Lyme World is not Emphasized Enough, Until You Have It

The next two paragraphs are needed to get to the position I am taking in this post:.

I have no doubt Lyme symptoms I have experienced started in 2001 or 2002. It took 11+ years to finally get a diagnosis, even though I did get much better between 2006 and 2011. I thought whatever it was had, mostly, passed. When all fell apart in late 2011, I spent 1.5 years looking for why and what it was. In 2013, was finally found to have Lyme Disease.

By late 2014, I was back to about 80%. That was after different treatment regiments, mainly Bicillin. That tells me other co-infections may not have been in play then. For 18 months, I stayed at 80% or better, but now I know heart surgery in June, 2016, opened the door for a much more weakened immune system and more co-infections and EBV.

Since heart surgery (not related to Lyme), I have not been able to get anywhere near where I once was before surgery. IN fact, things are much worse. I now believe with my immune system so weak, reactivated EBV stepped in. For two years, I couldn't understand why I was so tired every afternoon and had a mild fever. Finally, a doctor did an EBV test, and the results showed very high positives in every EBV test. That includes IgM,and it remains very high. Nothing has changed in four tests and almost two years.

That leads me to wonder why I had never heard of EBV for all the years before, despite seeing multiple LLMDs and naturopaths. When I first saw EBV on a test, my question was "What is that?" I was told it is a virus and will pass.

The more I read about EBV, the more I wonder why it took so long to do the test. Now, with all the information I have read concerning the consequence of reactivated EBV, and potential consequence, it is odd it (EBV) was never mentioned. Considering how EBV can make you feel, then throw in the possible autoimmune/cancer components, it seems this would have been on radar long before it was finally tested.

And even when it was finally tested and recognized, the importance of it was not emphasized. Now, I believe, it has lead to an autoimmune problem of some type and it gets the mind wondering about cancer.

I've read cancer is not often caused by EBV, and happens much more often in southeast Asia and Africa. As the American Cancer Society puts in "Overall, very few people who have been infected with EBV will ever develop these cancers."

But the mere fact it very well could cause autoimmune problems and, possibly, cancer, tells me testing early on in diagnosis of Lyme is critical, along with monitoring. After a year and three months of daily fevers, especially late afternoon, fatigue, and inability to be in the sun for long, I question not looking into the situation even more, especially if someone goes through a surgery, very stressful life event or anything else that might compromise immune system. Had I known after surgery, I would have immediately done more immune boosting and less killing.

Maybe others have had a different experience with this or point of view. It would be interesting to know.

If someone knows you are, unknowingly, going to be walking in an area known to be heavily populated by poisonous snakes, it would be helpful to be informed of that. Precautions could be made. But once bit, it's too late.

So you know about the Medical Medium - Anthony Williams' theory about most things being caused by EBV. (?)

I had two Drs test EBV and all the herpes virus- and it was always negative.

I remember kids in school having it a lot - but it was called Mono then.

But either way, his whole celery juice BS is really about elevating stomach acid. Just take HCL which is way more effective. I do that when my gut is off and it improves.

Contrary to popular beleife, most adults do not have enough HCL in them. Low HCL can even cause GERD from improper digestion.- who would have thought.

As far as the rest of his diet, yes eliminating junk will make you feel better. The whole meat is bad theory, well, Georgia thinks so too. But - each persons ability to properly digest X and Y depends on their independent body. And that has an effect of what "gut bugs" one has - then affecting health.

A "spirit" did not tell me this, learning did lol.

Post Edited (astroman) : 2/22/2020 6:06:37 PM (GMT-7)

It’s something like 80% of people have gotten EBV. Most get it when young and it’s no big deal. If you get it when you’re older it’s not as easy.

But Running Wild shows high positive IgM and IgG titers. In addition, he’s running a fever he can’t shake. In addition, he’s got renal problems and EBV is known to hit the kidneys. It does sound like a reactivated case. Question is what does he do next to rid himself of it? He can’t take Valtrex because of the kidney issue. Mirabavir is in the pipeline and sounds like it could work but not FDA approved yet

I agree with you Astro I’m big on the stomach acid thing. Also bile. I take Zypan for stomach acid, Tudca for bile and Beef liver as well.

Post Edited (dcd2103) : 2/22/2020 6:59:47 PM (GMT-7)

If you show reactivated other options would be lauricidin and maybe biocidin or lemon balm. I have not researched these to know if they are acceptable with kidney issues.

https://www.prohealth.com/library/lack-of-stomach-acid-hypochlorhydria-can-cause-lots-of-problems-24932

[ "Failure to sterilize the stomach contents. This will make individuals more susceptible to gut infections such as gastro-enteritis and possibly enteroviruses such as Epstein-Barr virus, Coxsackie virus, Echovirus, and so on.

Gastric acid is an essential part of normal defenses against disease. Gastric acid is also essential for getting rid of undesirable bacteria and yeast that appear in the diet. Particularly virulent strains, of course, may cause simple food poisoning. However, if there is an overgrowth of bacteria and yeast in the stomach, then foods will get fermented instead of being digested. This produces wind and gas resulting in bloating and alcohols which may or may not be useful to the body." ]

EBV can be in the gut. If it is, and not eradicated, it will never go away.

My Functional Dr drilled "gut health" into me way before treating lyme., because of everything that can be there that shouldn't and then the fact that your gut is a good part of immune health.

Supplemental Betain HCL , D-limonine and KAL Magnesium Glycinate were/are the three best supplements Ive ever used - they all help gut health and I feel better from them. Changing from Levothyroxin to "Pig thyroid" with T3 also improved digestion and gut health.

Of course some people naturally have high levels of stomach acid, but not many (again, contrary to popular belief).

I have also used Dr Mecolas Gall bladder Enzymes- st times this seemed to help.

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I also have many "bad" liver phase II genes. So Im possibly screwed from the start digestive-wise. Again, the same Dr said he knew I was not a hard drinker...... cause Id be dead long ago.

Post Edited (astroman) : 2/22/2020 10:14:39 PM (GMT-7)

I’ve never been tested for ebv -

Is it possible I could have it without any fatigue?

Girlie said...
I’ve never been tested for ebv -

Is it possible I could have it without any fatigue?

Then test for it. Its a standard test, not the weird labs were used to.

Sudden onset Mono, will have fatigue, not sure about when/ how long.

The idea that this can go further and deeper, like lyme, is not supported by conventional medicine as far as I can tell. The testing is supported though. Related- my Candida antibody tests were always spot on with my symptoms - this open the eyes of my general GP Dr. as no-one came to him with this before or mentioned the test. He learned.

Websites talking about it do not seem to have original content - so far what I found is regurgitated info by the Medical Medium guy (they at least mention this prob as a disclaimer) who lacks proof of anything. If someones smart enough to figure something out- they proudly mention proof they found in the process.

cdc - My dentist does ozone treatments via the ear. Don't know if it is possible to buy a machine that will do it and will look into that. Good idea. Have you decided to try and get tested for it?

Girlie - I don't know if it always causes fatigue, initially. I know I have felt it, sometimes worse, sometimes better. And I have learned, as much I hate to admit this, there have been certain tests I felt were needed, knowing so many doctors don't have a clue. If nothing else, to rule out problems. With that said, if you suddenly felt fatigue and mentioned that to the doctor.... if you see what I mean.

Seems EBV is common in so many of those with Lyme, it makes sense to rule it in or out. And as astroman mentioned, the tests are good for it. I have all Labcorp testing done.

Runningwild: "Girlie - I don't know if it always causes fatigue, initially. I know I have felt it, sometimes worse, sometimes better. And I have learned, as much I hate to admit this, there have been certain tests I felt were needed, knowing so many doctors don't have a clue. If nothing else, to rule out problems. With that said, if you suddenly felt fatigue and mentioned that to the doctor.... if you see what I mean. "

Yup, I get what you're putting down....lol. Now that you mention it, I am feeling the fatigue....

That’s good news runningwild and great that lyme isn’t being dismissed.


Did I already mention that I took my elderly friend (92) to the “Wellness Centre”) for her appt and her GfR is up to 34 or 35 (can’t remember which)
She was previously in the high 20’s.
The kidneys can recover!!

Yah, I think the younger docs may have lyme on their radar...

I have HSV2, when I first got it I was terrified but read so many things saying it’s no big deal we’ll it definitely wasn’t no big deal for my body! I got very very sick including Candida, extend nerve pain, migraines and many other symptoms. I have a gene mutation so I’m wondering if things like EBV and mono effect those of us with these gene issues. I know Takuna can help both viruses.

running wild, I know you have heard from me a lot, and I'm not much help to you, but nevertheless....

When I first got disablingly sick, my EBV test was negative. Four weeks later, my IgG level was high and has remained that way for the past four years, not really budging at all.

My most recent tests were as follows:
EBV early antigen = 51 (positive = >11)
EBV VCA IGG = >750 (positive = >22)
EBV EBNA IGG = 118 (positive = >22)

So yes, I have had high IgG EBV levels for four years.

And wow, I'm so glad that your kidney docs are open to considering Lyme and EBV! That is great news, as is finding nothing autoimmune and not much damage! I'm sure you've mentioned that, but what exactly is wrong with your kidneys, as of this past appointment? Does this positive check-up mean you might be able to incorporate more types of treatment that you previously needed to avoid?