HealingWell
Search Close Search
☰

Support Forums
>
Lyme Disease
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
1 2
❬ ❬ Previous Thread |Next Thread ❭ ❭
Posted 10/22/2021 5:28 AM (GMT -5)
yep, that's what i was pointing to - if you are an endurance athlete or fully slim and still have type 2 diabetes it likely that rather than too much carbs in the diet forcing over excretion of insulin and then insulin tolerance - something else is severely messing with the insulin mechanism - probably something altogether different and the insulin dysregulation is a secondary effect - possibly something in the stress response pathways.

if it were me i would be wary of just adding metformin and living with it - as that is a bit of a sticking plaster - not addressing the root - would be worth trying to find the underlying cause - as with it being unknown it could be driving other pathologies. maybe some good functional MD's can help in that area if they specialise in Type 2 Diabetes - in the USA there should be plenty.
Posted 10/22/2021 9:19 AM (GMT -5)
Ive only skimmed this thread, didn't read the links in depth....yet(!). The taking naltrexone for this is very interesting.

So Ive had three blood sugar phases in my 50-ish years, and during which time my lyme "waxed and waned" but did not totally consume me till 6-15 years ago:

1)It was that last period (6-15 yrs ago) that my fasting glucose was also the highest (low 110-120's).
2)Second highest was before that when I was still competing and lyme did not yet control my life, but it was there (100-105).
3)Im older now, lyme is under control, I dont compete (so less physical and mental stress), I dont work out as much, and fasting glucose is better (90-99),..... but certainly far from ideal.

No, I dont have diabetes, but being how Im fit and eat healthy, my glucose should be MUCH lower, something is going on.

Since I cant really improve my diet (and it makes little glucose difference), this should be my winter health project. But........this has way less info than lyme. Like I said, the diabetes forum here at healing well is mostly repeated conventional info- no real help there, Ive tried.

A functional Dr who treats Type 2 Diabetes successfully would be a dream, the ones I did see with lyme didnt have any special glucose tricks up their sleeves though. . I want to avoid metformin at all costs, and im obviously getting older. I should maybe look into some athlete forums too, anyone there with higher glucose will be taking about it, as its not normal, but also not totally uncommon.

I appreciate the info on this thread................dont stop yet!
Posted 10/22/2021 9:29 AM (GMT -5)
Metformin is NOT a solution. I don’t believe LDN cures diabetes either. If you understand the mechanism behind it, it makes no sense

Best way to fix a sugar problem is to limit sugar. This seems like it should be obvious to modern medicine, yet it doesn’t seem to be
Posted 10/22/2021 10:22 AM (GMT -5)

dcd2103 said...


Best way to fix a sugar problem is to limit sugar. This seems like it should be obvious to modern medicine, yet it doesn’t seem to be

For the "average" sugar loaded, western diet couch potato....probably.

But thats not the fix for everyone. There has got to be more than one "mechanism" to diabetes.

If that comment was for me..........I dont think you understand my situation (and others ive heard about) that I explained here. I can eat no sugar and very little carbs and workout and still have fasting glucose in the 90's, tried that for ONE YEAR. And Im still fit for a 50's guy, even if compared to todays teens lol.

For some of us, there is more to it than limiting sugar. Its just not known in conventional medicine yet. I didnt grow up in a "sugar" household either, my parents were old school veggies and meat with fruit for snacks.. My friends parents fully supported the sugar industry, so I knew the difference, they ate like crap.

Since conventional medicine has Metformin, they prob wont dig deeper (scary).

Post Edited (astroman) : 10/22/2021 9:29:18 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 10/22/2021 10:42 AM (GMT -5)
When I went full keto for about 6 months I still had fasting blood sugar in the upper 90s. Prior to full keto it was usually 100-105. It went down a little but limiting carbs was not the solution for me. I also dont get the spikes after eating. Usually only gets up 110ish or so after a meal. I was obsessed for a while checking it to the point I had all the little black spots on my fingers. My A1C is lower side of normal range. At times I think I have a episode of being hypoglycemic Ill have all the symptoms of it but my blood sugar is still mid 90s in these cases. Its relieved with food.
Posted 10/22/2021 10:55 AM (GMT -5)
Joe- looks like we have more than lyme in common, odd glucose.
------------------------------
Everyone- we need to remember the liver is the sugar storage place, and it will open the glucose flood gates when signaled by the adrenal glands (cortisol), from stress or physical needs.

In my case I have quite a few "bad" liver genes. I think there is a connection. I also have high normal cortisol in the AM, tested by all (yes all) possible testing available > functional and conventional. Its lower than the past but still high normal. I think this is also a connection............and why average people will have higher glucose after caffeine (elevates cortisol) consumption. I made a poll on that in another forum years ago, those who participated had similar results.

Elevated Cortisol= high glucose for a few hrs. This is why holy basil which can lower cortisol can also lower blood sugar. I’ve used it for cortisol and surprisingly found my fasting glucose to be 5-15 points lower on it. But it’s said you should not take adrenal adaptogens long term. I will test this again to see if results are the same as before.

I used to finger prick blood test like crazy.

Post Edited (astroman) : 10/22/2021 11:44:01 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 10/22/2021 11:08 AM (GMT -5)
The terms "carbs" and "sugar" are rarely defined in conversation and are often conflated. All sugars are carbs, but not all carbs are "sugar."

Anyway, is "sugar" the problem or the inability to metabolize it properly? Perhaps I'm splitting hair, but there's often a lot of loose language around the topic.

People say that ice cream is a "carb," but it often has a lot of fat, too. A serving of Ben & Jerry's vanilla ice cream has 27 grams of sugar (actual sugar) and 21 grams of fat. So, is it "high" in sugar? Yes and no. Yes, it has a lot of sugar, relative to, say, a steak. But in grams, the sugar is nearly equivalent to fat. Something with three ingredients can't be "high" in all three things, relative to each other. If something is high, the other things have to be low.

Example: If we're talking about carbs, fat, and protein, let's say a random food has 75% of its calories as "carbs." That means the remaining 25% is NOT carbs. So, it's high-carb, relative to the other macronutrients. But, if there's 33.3% carbs, 33.3% fat, and 33.3% protein in a random food, than the food is not "high" in any of these. Again, relative to each other. It depends upon what one is measuring something against.

I realize this is nitpicking, but I also think details matter. If I have anything wrong, I welcome correction.

Finally, of course, not everyone may be able to correctly metabolize "sugar." Thus, keeping it low in the diet seems warranted. But, again, that's managing the symptoms and not correcting the dysfunction. If the dysfunction can't be corrected, then symptom management is clearly the way to go.
Posted 10/22/2021 12:12 PM (GMT -5)

astroman said...


For the "average" sugar loaded, western diet couch potato....probably.

But thats not the fix for everyone. There has got to be more than one "mechanism" to diabetes.

If that comment was for me..........I dont think you understand my situation (and others ive heard about) that I explained here. I can eat no sugar and very little carbs and workout and still have fasting glucose in the 90's, tried that for ONE YEAR. And Im still fit for a 50's guy, even if compared to todays teens lol.

For some of us, there is more to it than limiting sugar. Its just not known in conventional medicine yet. I didnt grow up in a "sugar" household either, my parents were old school veggies and meat with fruit for snacks.. My friends parents fully supported the sugar industry, so I knew the difference, they ate like crap.

Since conventional medicine has Metformin, they prob wont dig deeper (scary).

Actually wasn’t aimed at you Astro. More aimed at Metformin and also LDN as being cures.

But…“Eating no sugar” is different than being in ketosis or intermittent fasting. Unless you did either one of those strictly, then you can’t say burning off glycogen/glycogen storage hypothesis didn’t work. Were you actually in ketosis? Did you try strict IF? Doesn’t sound like it, and that’s what’s required to burn off excess visceral/organ fat that causes diabetes. You will know it’s happening if you’re triglycerides spike initially

As expected, when I went into ketosis, my triglycerides spiked like crazy, because of said mechanism. My moron dr wanted to put me on a statin. Also as expected, they now are lower than pre-keto and my A1C is down from 5.6 to a 4.9. Not using that as proof, just n=1, but worthwhile to share.

All of that being said, I’m thinking about coming out of ketosis. For a small minority it can be very dehydrating and I’ve had trouble balancing electrolytes. May move to paleo w or wo IF, my blood sugar numbers are good now. My SIBO is also gone, and I had it BAD (102 ppm hydrogen)

Edit: Also, apologies if I offended you. I like to argue my point, but don’t want to be offensive, even tho in the past when I’ve reread stuff I’ve written I realize the way I phrase things too confidently can be off-putting. Guess I owe Quin an apology since I disagreed w LDN

Post Edited (dcd2103) : 10/22/2021 11:27:03 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 10/22/2021 12:36 PM (GMT -5)

dcd2103 said...
As expected, when I went into ketosis, my triglycerides spiked like crazy, because of said mechanism. My moron dr wanted to put me on a statin.

That's funny. Great job on getting your trigs and A1c back in line.

dcd2103 said...
All of that being said, I’m thinking about coming out of ketosis. For a small minority it can be very dehydrating and I’ve had trouble balancing electrolytes.

about how much protein do you eat on an average day? Do you have an approximate number of grams? The reason I ask is I was halfway listening to something on YouTube this morning and it was pertaining to keto and electrolytes. Based on your answer, I may have to go back and listen again.
Posted 10/22/2021 12:50 PM (GMT -5)
Dcd - no offense. Ya I’ve never done the full ketosis.

I did expect lower blood glucose from just limiting sugars and white starches, so It was somewhat disappointing. My gut liked it though , which was the main reason I did it.
Posted 10/22/2021 1:14 PM (GMT -5)
So for my husband - he’s never expected for the the metformin to be a cure but it’s a treatment that works for keeping his blood sugars in range. He will be on it the rest of his life. (Unless it stops working at some point)

He finds one benefit - when he takes it and works out (weights) - the metformin helps.
Posted 10/22/2021 1:23 PM (GMT -5)
Astro: I sent you an e-mail, earlier today. Just FYI, in case you don't monitor it too often.
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
12