Additional detox methods - any suggestions?

Hi all, I’d be really grateful for any suggestions of detox methods to add to my existing regimen. I’m wondering if my long list of existing interventions is missing out one or more organ systems and that’s why I’m still herxing to the point of being incapacitated even on very low doses of relatively innocuous stuff like berberine (main herx symptom is fatigue so severe I can barely talk etc)

So far I am taking:

- daily Epsom salt baths
- binders - GI Detox (most days) and toxaprevent (once a week)
- milk thistle
- quercetin
- very high doses of vitamin C
- all the cofactor nutrients for phase 1 and 2 liver detox (vitamin A, E, etc)
- regular B12 injections
- liposomal glutathione
- lots and lots of water (specifically, 2 litres per day of the WHO’s oral rehydration solution)
- high CFU probiotic

My diet is also super clean (autoimmune paleo for almost a year with no deviation)

Any suggestions much appreciated!

Okra powder is great I've heard. Haven't tried it myself but it is. Himalayan sea salt keep a lot of my symptoms at bay believe it or not. I stopped activated charcoal as it was pulling out and binding to all the essential vitamins and minerals that you need to have. That's not good because then I got extra symptoms from becoming vit deficient. A better choice would be bentonite liquid detox. Bile salts every single day move the bowels for is most important for me and makes me feel way better. I only eat 2 meals or 3 meals per day helps more. I eat mostly protein. Chicken, salmon fish or turkey. Lemon water. Ginger , cinnamon. Sauna is the best detox for me tbh.

My first question is, what is a low dose to you?? I had to start on incredibly low doses of a very weak tea (the gentlest form of herbal medicine). So we all have a place we need to start, and we must be careful comparing dose sizes.

The only two things I could think of that you may wish to include is if you have access to an infrared sauna. This seems to be quite helpful for a lot of people.

Also, lymph massages. I like to suggest that we do this for ourselves most of the time. Why? Because we need this daily, and it needs to not be too aggressive, so is often most beneficial for those of us that are struggling to do our own lymph massages daily.

Just a few thoughts to ponder...

i had massive herx effects from berberine containing herbs - even at 1ml per day

the interesting thing is - berberine acts mainly in the gut - as it does not get absorbed very well systemically - 90+% of it remains in the gut

i could not work out how something that stayed in the gut - could make someone with a systemic infection like me - feel so ill - and for a long time this sent me down several rabbit holes to do with gut health - thinking it must be some kind of gut infection that was driving my overall symptoms.

this was not really the case - what i came to understand was going on is that bartonella infects and inflames the tissues of the gut - messing up gut permeability and inflaming the immune system - such that when you then kill bacteria in the gut - by products cross through the leaky gut membrane and give you lots of systemic symptoms - in my case massive fatigue, headaches, body aches etc
how much of this was from killing bartonella in the gut ( it is known to infect the cells that line the gut) and how much was just from killing normal commensal bacteria i cannot say - but i suspect a lot of it was just from normal commercial bacteria being killed
high dose probiotics - or even pre biotics would do similar things to me

i still take some berberine containing herbs - but focus mainly on more systemic herbs that are known to be active for bartonella now - sida acuta, Cryptolepis etc - as well as other treatments that are known to be effective for bartonella as antimicrobials - eg methylene blue and oregano oil

i had to start these low also - and only gradually work up the doses over many months - but they have definitely helped me on my path to recovery ( i am around 60% recovered now )

before i could tolerate even these low doses of killing herbs - i first had to do a bunch of stuff that reduced my overall reactivity
-diet changes to reduce the reactivity of my system - Keto was a game changer
-focus on sleep
-anti-inflammatory and immune modulating herbs for Lyme etc to help control inflammation

i thought it might help as food for thought

Post Edited (Garzie) : 1/13/2023 4:25:52 AM (GMT-8)

RainyCloud said...
Omega33: thanks for that information, very interesting, do you grow your own?

Garzie: berberine can cause constipation, just a heads up in case that was ever an issue for you. It's very effective for candida by the way.

Thanks Rainy - True - but i think anything that changes the gut microbiota can do this - which is probably why berberine does - but ABX can do - even dietary changes can - its a delicate balance in there - so many things can cause it to get a bit upset - and it can then go one way or another.

with most natural things i find it typically finds its own balance sooner or later - especially if the diet is otherwise pretty good

my current experience with oil of oregano is that this seems to cause me some degree of constipation off and on - more than most things - but i am still in the ramp up phase - so i am hoping this too with settle down once the dose is stable

RainyCloud said...
Thanks Garzie, those are all great points and I agree with them. For what it's worth I had trouble with oregano oil hurting my stomach but that seemed to have stopped. So it's kind of like what you're saying, certain side effects just settle down over time.

not sure how you are taking it Rainy - but i am using it in pure 90% carvacrol essential oil form - and taking it just before meals a few drops in a tablespoon of extra virgin olive oil - which dilutes it and makes it way less aggressive on the throat and stomach. just thought i would pass it on in case its of help. v inexpensive this way also
i am at around 110mg carvacrol a day now and aiming for around 150

apologies to the OP for the thread drift

Wow thanks so much for all your suggestions! I had forgotten I made this thread and now I have all these extra detox methods to look into. Definitely going to look more into dry brushing and IR saunas - I agree with Sara that I should probably not add much more to the mix internally!

Garzie - that’s really interesting stuff about Bartonella infecting the gut. I suspect I have Bart too. I started taking Cryptolepis recently and the only side effects I’m seeing so far (aside from lots more muscle twitching) are all GI related - nausea, gas, pain, etc.