Apparently I have some coinfections....

Is it strange that I have funky coinfections like chlamydia and mycoplasma, but not the regular infections like bartonella or babesia?

Testing negative for co-infections does not mean that you don't have them.

Bartonella has many species and they only test for a few. There are also "Bartonella Like Organisms" or "BLO," which will not show on a Bart test. Not to mention, labs like LabCorp and Quest are not specialized in this area.

Fry Labs is well respected when it comes to Bart testing. However, someone can have BLO, which won't show up, or Bartonella with a negative test. For that reason, many LLMD's clinically diagnose and treat co-infections based on symptoms.

There is also "Bab-Lo" for Babesia like symptoms.

My Quest test came back negative for Bart and Babesia, but my LLMD is still treating me based on clinical symptoms.

Simela, a negative test from IGENEX for Lyme also does not mean that a person does not have Lyme. There are many reasons why someone who has Lyme can test negative:

http://www.mentalhealthandillness.com/seronegativelymedisease.html

I'd be willing to bet that 90% or more of the people on this forum have co-infections. Borrellia isn't that hard to kill, but when you have a lowered immune response due to "other" pathogens, it's almost impossible to kill.

Utah gal I have chlamydia and mycoplasma and bartonella. That's just what I tested positive for.

I think our bodies and infections are pretty similar. Let me know if you find anything that helps. The taurine isn't as amazing as it was at first but still helping I think. Have you tried it out?

Do you have the same symptoms everyday?

So, why is it that babs and Bart are the infections that everyone focuses on? I rarely hear/read anyone mention chlamydia or mycoplasma.

Wouldn't it be likely that I also have a babs or Bart problem?

My LLMD seems to feel I have ehrlichia, based on my symptoms....
Anxiety attacks
Weakness
Poor memory/cognition
Insomnia
Hair loss
Mild fatigue (I feel more " run down" than tired)

I thought babs and Bart were more common? Nobody talks about the other ones I mentioned. My LLMD didn't do further testing for babs and Bart, other than the negative results from lab corp.

..

Part of the reason why Babs and Bart are talked about more than any other co-infections is because when combined with Lyme, they are very hard to get rid of, the symptoms overlap, and when combined with Lyme they also lower the immune system even more - Myco and chlamydia don't have that "reputation". While they may cause significant issues for some people, like you possibly, overall the more stubborn infections are with Lyme, Bart & Babs.

I was told by Dr. Edwin Masters - a great LLMD and Lyme researcher in the Midwest (R.I.P)- that I had all of the tick-borne infections, including Myco (but I don't know about the chlamydia) and the only infections I actually targeted were Lyme, Bart and Babs and healed from everything. Usually if a person has all of those, and they target the harder to heal infections, the infections that aren't so bad are taken care of as the immune system is raised - at least that's how I understand it.

Utahgal said...
What worries me is

Ex: Rowingmom told me that her daughter was about 70% better (or something like that....can't remember exactly...). She had tested negative for babesia. She had no babesia symptoms. BUT, when Rowingmom gave her kid some Buhner babesia herbs, her child actually herxed! So, she actually did have babesia that everyone missed because she didn't suffer with typical babesia stuff like sweats and cough..... Once she was treated for babesia she got way better!!

But, based on Rowimgmom's story, how do I know that I really don't have those infections?

......

K was 80% better after 2 years of combo abx for bartonella. She improved another 19% with the addition of babesia herbs to Buhner's full bartonella protocol. I'm not talking a few herbs here - I mean all of them.

The thing about herbs is that you can treat the genus (ie bartonella-like-organisms or babesia-like- organisms) and hit most of the species that comprise it. Many herbs are widely antimicrobial, unlike abx monotherapy, and it perhaps doesn't matter if you don't know what you are treating.

I'm now reading Buhner's Antiviral Herbs book, and many of the herbs he recommends for babs/bart are highly antiviral as well. Who knows. Maybe with the babs/bart herbs we are using we are targeting undiagnosed viral infections as well. K was never tested for viruses but did have severe downturns with her MMR vaccines so maybe she was dealing that.

I find a little experimentation can be a good thing.

rowingmom:
Interesting! I was wondering about this for about of wee: if by using herbs, in addition to the tick-borne diseases the herbs are effective for other bacteria-like or virus like creatures. And now you gave me the answer. I suspected that is how it works! Who knows what else you killed with that stuff besides the lyme, barto and even bab!

Yes, I agree experimentation is a good thing, but I am super cautious because if I provoke too much of a response, the seizures may come back, and then I lose credibility in front of all the doctors that I have been telling over and over again that with abx his seizures are gone. They would absolutely LOVE to tell me I am wrong and perhaps even blame me for the herx reaction as being an irresponsible person and endangering my son. Since my son is not seen by an LLMD yet, I am not as brave as you to try sida yet! Not even one drop! If he gets breathing problems from it, and gets a seizure, and ends up the the hospital because of something that I DID, I can get in a lot of trouble I think. Not brave enough to take the risk :(

"The coinfection tests are unreliable, like Lyme. Just because you test negative, does not mean you can rule it out"

Right, you can't. Keep trying to talk to your LLMD about babesia and others, and see what she says.

Utahgal said...
So, why is it that babs and Bart are the infections that everyone focuses on? I rarely hear/read anyone mention chlamydia or mycoplasma.

Wouldn't it be likely that I also have a babs or Bart problem?

My LLMD seems to feel I have ehrlichia, based on my symptoms....
Anxiety attacks
Weakness
Poor memory/cognition
Insomnia
Hair loss
Mild fatigue (I feel more " run down" than tired)

I thought babs and Bart were more common? Nobody talks about the other ones I mentioned. My LLMD didn't do further testing for babs and Bart, other than the negative results from lab corp.

..

You just described metal toxicity. Unless you address this, it will be difficult to remove any pathogens.

"My LLMD seems to feel I have ehrlichia, based on my symptoms....
Anxiety attacks
Weakness
Poor memory/cognition
Insomnia
Hair loss
Mild fatigue (I feel more " run down" than tired)"

Yes—could be hey metals, could be hormonal (HPA axis/endocrine)…


My LLMD tested me initially for Bb, Babesia and Bartonella because they were my main sx. She suspected I had more co-infections but we decided that since we can't treat it all at the same time anyway, to address the dominant sx first…

-p

Pirouette said...
Utahgal—

Do you know why she said no to A-Bab?

-p

If you already have oxidative stress, killing pathogens will just cause more oxidative stress and more problems will arise. You can't overcome it and the treatment will fail. You must first reduce the oxidative stress before treating pathogens. To do this, you must first get the methylation pathways functioning properly so that the free radicals are reduced. To get the methylation pathways functioning correctly, you must remove the metals that are blocking each pathway. Removing the metals can also cause oxidative stress so it must be done slowly.

If I had anxiety or GERD, I'd try to eliminate the aluminum sequestered in the GI tract first.