Does Quercitin work on bart like a fluoroquinolone?

So I tried the full Buhner bart protocol for a week way back in may... WOW... Very very intense herxing, for literally every single day I was on it, and I was working full 12 hour days the whole time, and for 6 straight days!

Anyways, while taking some time off... I had like no symptoms at all, but only continued the herbs and stopped the L-arginine, the quercitin, and the egcg. Bart symptoms were basically gone completely, or at times were very very mild to hardly noticeable.

Now I have been taking the full Buhner bart protocol again, this time I'm going to go for the full 30 days like he recommends.

But I was looking into quercitin and it is supposed to bind to the exact same spot as a fluoroquinolone!? Well I just quickly skim through research papers but that seems like what I have been finding. Anyways back with the quercitin... back with the herx! lol

Does this happen to anyone else taking high doses of quercitin for bart? Or does anyone else know if quercitin acts like a fluoroquinolone binding to bacterial DNA gyrase.

Buhner claims it is important in blocking the cytokine cascade... But for me it is the total opposite and cranks the cytokine storm up like 10 times! As in... There has got to be at least 10 times more inflammation in my body when I take the quercitin.

My concern is you took the whole buhner protocol for a week? If that statement is correct, you may have taken the herbs incorrectly. I wish buhner would have been more explicit in how to take the herbs. I learned how to take the herbs the hard way - all on my own.

Everyone on this forum told me to start low and go slow. I was told to start one herb, 1 drop a day to see how I got along with the herb. Then slowly up that drop to 3 times a day, then 2 drops, 3 times a day and slowly "ramp" up the dose. After about a week or maybe even 2 weeks, you then are suppose to add in the next herb. Once again going low and slow just as you did with the first herb.

You then can tell if you have any reactions.

Also, the 30 days does not sound correct. You take the herbs until you have been symptom free for 2 months. In my case, I took them for 5 months being symptom free because I wanted to make sure Babs was gone and Babs relies on the life of a red blood cell - which is anywhere from 5 to 200 days.

You might want to re-think your approach to doing Buhners.

Also quercetin is not part of his core protocol.

Cytokine remodulation (pg 214) - Salvia miltiorrhiza (Red Sage) and Scutellaria baicalensis (Skullcap or Huang Qin) - these are Buhner recommendations.

Yep, back to the "what works for some people, doesn't work for every peraon" thing. I use a fairly low dose of quercetin, and it's been helping me with my inflammation and even my digestion. You may wish to try a lower dose.

And I too would be concerned if you only used Buhner's for 30 days only. If you are going by the website, a patient set that up, not Buhner, and that's something they misunderstood, according to those that have read Buhner's treatment books.

Peteza - That is interesting starting low and slow and I do hear that often on the forum... But, I have been treating for 2 and a half years now. My goal is to keep increasing the dose until it is gone, and I can get to that symptom free point. But good point, I should keep going after being symptom free for 2 months which is my plan now. Quercitin is actually part of the protocol, I have his book. His bartonella protocol in his book actually seems to include much more for the core part than on his website.

Georgia - Binds to the same receptor, which receptor are you talking about? You raise a good point though... I shouldn't point the response in my body to just quercitin, but potentially it could be egcg, the L-arginine, or the quercitin... In addition to that I was also slamming it with high doses of monolaurin, and ACS 200 spray. I just read a few articles saying quercitin could bind to the same spot in bacteria as fluoroquinolones, so I was just curious about the possibility. I was thinking if you have read anything about this Georgia? I know you like to read lots of research papers. After this week of intense treatment my foot pain and aches, inflammation, it was ALL gone! But then I stuck with JUST the herbs (Houttuynia, sida acuta, alchornea, etc...), and symptoms slowly came back. So no ACS200 as I ran out, no monolaurin as I just got lazy taking that, and no l-arg, quercitin, or egcg.

Krimpet - Thanks for that info on histamine. Lowers histamine? But if this is the case my histamine must have went really high as I was taking the quercitin it was high and off the quercitin is fewer symptoms. Also I don't know what my histamine levels are and have never tested for that. All I know my remaining symptoms are Bart like, foot aches, pain, burning, and many other symptoms I blame bart for. I guess it could be other things, but to me it's bart as I didn't have these symptoms before bart.

Mister Mike - Thanks for your words, yes I'm still here and still experimenting with getting well. Although ya, my symptoms and level of disability is pretty low, I still have the chronic symptoms of foot aches, inflammation, ... Also when I did that full week I had sleeping issues again, AND really red eyes! Inflammation went through the roof. But geez was it ever a relief after that week, I felt so close to normal, actually I was pretty much symptom free. Right now, I'm on the FULL buhner bart protocol, but ordered more of the ACS 200 (recommended for bart by Dr. M the bart guru himself), AND I will do full doses of monolaurin. LOL, keeping my fingers crossed.

Traveler - I have read from his own words, ALL for 30 days for bartonella. He said IF the symptoms come back again, then the dosage was not high enough and to do it all over again at a higher dose. He also stresses the importance of individualized treatments and making adjustments. I did read one person who did the FULL buhner bart protocol for 2 months and symptoms have never returned since.