HealingWell
Search Close Search
☰

Herb reset / Bone pain question...

Support Forums
>
Lyme Disease
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply
❬ ❬ Previous Thread |Next Thread ❭ ❭
Posted 3/24/2021 6:49 AM (GMT -5)
Did a herb reset stopping all herbs and developed bone pain. What exactly causes that type of bone pain. I’m guessing bartonella since it was so fast to develop and subside. Is there a specific mechanism that does it (that Bart is using/promoting)?

Post Edited (sandyfeet) : 2/19/2022 5:49:04 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 3/24/2021 8:06 AM (GMT -5)
Hi sandyfeet!

So the pain first appeared while off all herbs? Sounds like before reintroducing the herbs you had some sort of a balance that became disrupted (captain obvious over here).. guessing it was a case of more inflammatory cytokines aggravating the synovial tissue.

Echinacea augustifolia is considered an immune stimulant.. not sure about technical nature of it but I'd imagine it promotes an inflammatory immune response. Has it been apart of your long-term protocol?

I also think with some of the herbs we may just build sort of a tolerance to them after long term usage, and that tolerance can be lost but it's not necessarily a bad thing.

Post Edited (potsnpans) : 3/24/2021 8:22:02 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 3/24/2021 8:06 AM (GMT -5)
Sandyfeet,

Not sure what to say about the bone pain in knees and ankles. I have pain in those places at times, but I don’t recall bone pain.

Can you describe your burning and where it is?

Burning is a big one for me. I have been having burning tongue and mouth and am totally convinced it’s from mold, as it eases of when I am away from the house and car. My mom gets burning tongue from mold, too. I’m constantly asking her if she’s having it or how she feels. She’s stable and not having burning all the time, yet I am about to go crazy. I also have added a bunch of herbs at largish doses. The burning and increased mold, chemical, and EMF sensitivities kicked in hard after I started having UTI symptoms 2 months ago.
Posted 3/24/2021 8:11 AM (GMT -5)
I suspect the herbs were keeping bartonella and possibly other infections in check, and when you stopped and restarted, it upset something similar to what potsnpans described. I wonder if we really kill off much of anything, or if we’re just holding down the fort, so to speak.

Were you treating multiple infections or mainly bart?
Posted 3/24/2021 9:25 AM (GMT -5)
Maybe next time you have an opportunity to reassess your protocol you can withdraw one herb/supp at a time rather than all of them at once.

One time I had also been feeling great so I withdrew all at once and had trouble getting back to baseline.
Posted 3/24/2021 9:25 AM (GMT -5)
Sandyfeet,

Since arginine has worked so well for you, I wonder if once you get back to baseline if you might be able to maintain longterm remission with just arginine and maybe something for immune support.
Posted 3/25/2021 7:26 AM (GMT -5)

sandyfeet said...
The thing I find so puzzling about what feels like bone pain is that it can turn on or off so quickly. I used to worry that it meant there was some sort of lasting damage to bone health but that seems less likely and it’s some kind of cytokine thing


I notice this as well but only in the knee that I had arthroscopic surgery on a couple of years ago. It's hard to predict when it will flare.. it's definitely not the weather (which might indicate arthritis). I too think that it's local inflammation from Lyme related cytokines.

I wasn't aware that echinacea was an hyaluronidase inhibitor. I remember reading somewhere that it shouldn't be taken long-term, but perhaps the guidance was dose specific or maybe just overly cautious.
Posted 3/25/2021 7:51 AM (GMT -5)
I think youre right sandy feet that it is a cytokine thing. I dont think i have bartonella but i randomly get very sharp bone pain in my feet that will last for a couple days and then disappear. I'm unable to correlate it to anything.

I think a lot of these hebs can be powerful stimulators. I stay away from echinacea, cats claw, oil of oregano, garlic especially. Baikal skullcap is something i just ordered becasue of its anti cytokine/glial cell properties. I'm glad to hear it works for you.

Thats interesting that arginne works for you. I experimented with it a few times recently and felt like it helped my flares.
✚ New Topic ✚ Reply