not really improvement

OK this day is quite rough. I feel a bit like 4 weeks ago. Higher tempature and higher pulse and kind of sick feeling, pain all over my body. i just checked its literaly 4 weeks ago, does this can be a bartonella or lyme cycle? I felt the last days quite tired but i though its still die off from tinidazol. This diseas is just confusing, i felt quite ok the last 3 weeks. maybe its just a classic herx cycle and it will be better and better after it. at least is not so rough like 4 weeks ago....

i would agree - progress is not always continuous and linear - even when everything or almost everything is kept the same

i have found that since starting a very structures lifestyle - and keeping a detailed tracker of what interventions i am trying, lifestyle factors like diet , and what health outcomes i am getting - i do find that quite number of what i had previously thought were random fluctuations can be attributed to something that has in fact changed but i had not recognised at the time. like food, sleep, stress or a new supplement that was supposed to something good - but turned out to aggravate something altogether different.

but even with this highly structured regime there are still fluctuations in the overall upward trajectory that are very hard to explain -

so i wouldn't worry too much about it - you have been doing very well - so a little bump in the road now and then is to be expected - i wouldn't change anything dramatically due to feeling a bit worse than expected for a week - i would keep everything the same and wait for it to settle.

the only exception to this i think would be if you think its a kind of gradual accumulation of long lasting herx effects from treating hard for the last 3-4 weeks - if its becoming intolerable - then easing off a bit and waiting for things to rebound and and settle - then seeing where you are may be helpful

the monthly cycles we sometimes hear about being connected to the dividing time of borrelia or bartonella is largely old wives tales

both borrelia and bartonella have average dividing times of around 12-24hrs - though they can be made to divide more quickly than this in the lab

one species of bartonella - bartonella quintana - getis it name from the fact that it was known to cause a fever that repeated every 5 days. however this was not due to its dividing time - but to a feature of the infection that would release larger quantities of the bacteria into the blood at 5 day intervals.
to my knowledge no such mechanism has been seen in more common species of bartonella or Borrelia

its probably more likely that any changes in symptoms people experience on a monthly basis are caused by some interaction of the infection with the patients hormonal system and monthly hormonal cycles.

its also known that many women experience worsening of lyme systemptom around their menses which fits with this explanation.

keep up the good work - you have been doing great !

Hi firends,

Garzie, this is important "both borrelia and bartonella have average dividing times of around 12-24hrs - though they can be made to divide more quickly than this in the lab"
because to me it explains, why I have experienced a relapse after only 5-7 days after abx, when more or less major symptoms are settled, and after only these few days I start to feel something is coming back. It makes sense.

Palermo, yes, sometimes I m trying to listen to my body, eg even protocol says I should go on with abx, I feel its too much, I cant stand it any longer etc. But sometimes also if I stilll continue, I can see it was good, because it bring more herx. ITs not easy to interpret momentary sensations, pains. Often time I can feel un easiness in the liver area, but it can well be coming from bacteria, because many times happened - that I took abx (2-3 simultanously according to the protocol) and pain is gone. So the interpretation can be tricky. So I m trying to stick to protocol, nr. of days etc but again not strictly. Often times I have to interrupt because of work, or I have to perform so I can be on strong abx, with possible severe herxing or ups n downs..

Good luck, merry Christams!

Good to hear f your continued improvement Palermo

12,000 steps while still underging herx seems pretty good to me

keep up the good work and keep us posted

if you are not doing so already - you may well find substituting some strength training for some steps may help you with recovery a little further - as its good for immune function and metabolic health as well as mood / mental health.

you may have to start very low and with only v short workouts initially - but it seems to have been a key point for moving my own progress forward.

if its of any help - i have several post in the forum archive on how to go about adding exercise safely for people who have lyme

keep up the good work!