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Anybody using estradiol ?

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Posted 10/21/2010 6:59 AM (GMT -5)
So I am castrate-resistent and needed another therapy. David told me not to go for the chemo, but look into a 2nd-line hormonal therapy first. The Taxotere (docetaxel) chemo has a poor response (60%), is not very effective (55% chance of less than 50% PSA reduction), but there is a 26% chance of a 'serious adverse event'.

I asked my oncologist for DES, which has become popular since the dosis has been lowered to 1 mg per day or less. Or ketoconazol. But she offered me ethinyl estradiol. I am now taking 2 tablets of 0.05 mg per day, so this is a real low dosis. That will certainly help in reducing the side-effects, but... is it enough to be effective ?
I know estradiol patches would also have less side-effects but I am dependent on whatever my oncologist is familiar with.

Can anybody tell me what to expect from 0.1 mg/day ethinyl estradiol ? (I am only using it for 6 days now. Next PSA will be over a month from now.)
Posted 10/21/2010 12:44 PM (GMT -5)
Hi Arno:

I hope there are some good replies to this thread.

I am on Casodex right now and realize that sooner or later I will go resistant to ADT and so have been thinking about DES or Estradial patches.

FYI I have seen some good discussions on this over at YANA "You Are Not Alone".

Wish I knew how to add the link, but if you Google YANA it should come up.

...Don K...

Posted 10/21/2010 2:16 PM (GMT -5)
Arno - why are you limited to what your oncologist is familiar with? Any chance you could see, at least on a "second opinion" basis, an oncologist who is familiar with more options?
Posted 10/22/2010 3:09 AM (GMT -5)
Medved,
I went to a cancer institute for a 2nd opinion. The oncologist there believed in chemo only. Okay, he had also available a phase-3 clinical trial in which this chemo is to be combined with an anti-angiogenic. At least, when you do not get the placebo.

Somehow the pharmaceutical industry has convinced (and/or bribed) the medical profession into thinking that their very expensive chemo's and other new products are the only way to go. The hormonal drugs are usually much cheaper and equally effective or better.

In the end the only things that count with respect to whatever treatment for us, CRPC's, are: what will be the reduction in PSA and what is the progression free time ?
And we count our survival time in months, not years.

Doctor Strum once said: 'There are major problems with doctors around the world doing anything outside their own sphere of experience.'
And he also said: 'Patients become frustated with what they cannot get from their own local physician.'

Post Edited (Arno) : 10/22/2010 2:36:33 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 10/22/2010 3:42 PM (GMT -5)
So, do we see how it is out there? Apparently you understand this first hand now, what a system...The Best in the World, as everyone automatically eludes too. Probably the most profittable in the world too(talking about chemo and standard drugs like LHRH or even Leukine or Provenge), new hypocratic oath..."First make real bucks-$$$$ and do so without directly killing the patient". Then offer less options and make the patient dependent upon you until he dies or runs out of money!!!! (I know that was wicked thinking, but it is all about profits in todays culture...you the patient are equal to a used car or object in many cases). Now imagine your new 'Free' health care if you dare! It is possible to find other docs whom think differently, probably far from easy...but can be done. I love Dr. Strum for telling the world the reality of medicine in its present form.
Posted 10/23/2010 12:56 AM (GMT -5)
Sorry I did not in the topic, but I want to invite all and zufus to our forum:
www.gladiator-olsztyn.pl/?forum
We'd like to read important information about the problems of the prostate from experienced colleagues in the U.S..

I strongly invite

Yours
Posted 10/23/2010 10:43 AM (GMT -5)
Thanks Rakar I have actually done that and found some nice folks over there and you guys translated my english into your local language, which was a very nice gesture. Myself would like to hear all about how and what is done in other countries and about costs, options and/or is there open mindedness that is different than the USA, model. United throughout the world is greater concept for collaboration and defeat of the disease, treatment barriers and such.

Arno- I am not familar with that Rx on estradiol but likely would stop some of the side effects that Lupron and casodex produce. There is a guy whom posted a piece on the Ustoo.org website about his useage of estradiol and he has so far gone 5 years with good results and little side effect.
Posted 11/3/2010 11:57 AM (GMT -5)
Re: Zufus "switched to DES 1-mg" ?

As I am concidering Estradiol myself - after failing to reduce T and PSA by
means of Zoladex, am a bit confused by this " 1 -mg" Zufus ?

Estradiol - Estramustine trade name in US Emcyt, in Europe Estracyt ,

Quote RXlist:

EMCYT Capsules are indicated in the palliative treatment of patients with metastatic and/or progressive carcinoma of the prostate.
DOSAGE AND ADMINISTRATION

The recommended daily dose is 14 mg per kg of body weight (ie, one 140 mg capsule for each 10 kg or 22 lb of body weight), given in 3 or 4 divided doses. Most patients in studies in the United States have been treated at a dosage range of 10 to 16 mg per kg per day.

Patients should be instructed to take EMCYT Capsules at least 1 hour before or 2 hours after meals. EMCYT should be swallowed with water. Milk, milk products, and calcium-rich foods or drugs (such as calcium-containing antacids) must not be taken simultaneously with EMCYT.

Patients should be treated for 30 to 90 days before the physician determines the possible benefits of continued therapy. Therapy should be continued as long as the favorable response lasts. Some patients have been maintained on therapy for more than 3 years at doses ranging from 10 to 16 mg per kg of body weight per day.

Unquote

As for myself will start with 4 X 140 mg ,my body approx. 70 kg.
Also 200 mg Aspirin daily.

regards,
Bjorn

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PCA T3 N1M0 psa rising to 114 after failing 3 times zoladex
On permanent Foley catheter last 16 months
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