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Posted 1/20/2015 11:32 AM (GMT -5)
Hi guys,
What can I say. I am tired. I am so friggin tired. Omg I am tired. I am sitting where I accomplish my best work and I could fall asleep where I sit.! I have only been sleeping moderately well and average 6 1/2-7 hours a night but I awaken feeling like I have not slept at all. All night long my mind has been so active that I cannot dicern as to whether I am dreaming or having conscious thoughts. Suggestions please. Todd
Posted 1/20/2015 11:55 AM (GMT -5)
been there, too often. You must be worried about something - like the retirement thing that's all messed up? maybe? Are you still doing shift work? That will mess up your sleep, but you know that.

I had it real bad a couple of years ago - was only getting like 3 hours a night and it was messing up my general health. I went to see my PCP who decided to give me a week's worth of sleeping pills in the hope of resting my sleep pattern. Worked for me. Doesn't work for everyone.

Also, sometimes we sleep more than we think, but the real test is: do you feel rested after sleeping?

If it keeps up, you might want to call your doctor. There are some physical problems that can cause this, some medications can do this, but most likely it's worry, depression, fear of impending doom, aliens, big foot, or something emotional you need to tend too.

Take care of yourself,
Andrew
Posted 1/20/2015 12:18 PM (GMT -5)
Todd I am convinced that HT creates most of my fatigue. I do have nocturia so waking up frequently at night to use the bathroom does not help the situation. Thought that I had slept well last night and took my dogs for a run this morning and my legs felt like the were filled with cement. I am slowly accepting that I can no longer do the things that I once did and at the same speed in which I did them. In my prayers I give thanks for being able to do what I can do as I know others have it a lot worse. If my wife and I do something at night I really have to push thru the fatigue to go to whatever the occasion might be. My new normal, and it's better than being in a coffin, well sometimes.
Michael
Posted 1/20/2015 12:29 PM (GMT -5)
Might want to get checked for sleep apnea. Many years ago, I would wake up just as you described, as if I didn't sleep, went to get a sleep study and found out I had apnea.

I would suggest it to your GP who could order the study for you.
Posted 1/20/2015 12:38 PM (GMT -5)
I too have moderate to severe fatigue which really became noticeable after the Orchiectomy. I'm getting REM sleep but still dont have that rejuvenated feeling,some days are better than others but not by much. I was tested for apnea a year ago and found not to suffer from it. Mine I attribute to stress and zero testosterone.

Cheers, Doug
Posted 1/20/2015 12:44 PM (GMT -5)
Yeah, I was going to suggest sleep apnea too. The symptoms you describe are sleep apnea classics. My sleep apnea seems to be tied to my weight. When I weigh more than about 280 I need to sleep with a CPAP machine. But other guys who are skinny as a rail need the machine, too.

The way a sleep study works is you show up at the center at bedtime and they glue wires to you and strap monitors all over you until you are lumbering around like the swamp thing and then you get to drag it all into a bedroom with an infrared camera where the nurse watches you sleep and listens to you snore all night.

In the morning they pull off all the sticky pads and you drive yourself off to work. For me the biggest problem was pulling all those sticky pads out of my fur. (That was before the HT that has made me as hirsute as a plucked chicken and about as sexy too.)

If you have apnea you will be amazed at the difference the machine makes.
Posted 1/20/2015 12:48 PM (GMT -5)
I have experienced moderate to severe fatigue for about 18 months. I'm convinced now that PCa is the culprit, since no Doctor could find anything else wrong with me. Since I haven't undergone treatment yet, I was actually hoping that post treatment, I would start to feel better. If it gets any worse, I won't be able to get out of bed in the mornings.

Hoping you find some relief soon.
Posted 1/20/2015 12:50 PM (GMT -5)
Peter, in Sweden, where I was tested you do it at home! You tape a thingy on your finger, (like an O2 sensor) which in turn is hooked to a mini computer. You go back the next day, they download the data and give you the results. I did one like yours years ago, and yes, not pleasant.

Cheers, Doug
Posted 1/20/2015 12:59 PM (GMT -5)
I went in twice. Once for the study and once to get fitted. Each time I was hooked up and spent the night. My wife also went in for an apena and a nap study. She was there at night and during the day. She had to try and nap 5 times. She was able to nap 3. She said it was pretty brutal.

I don't have a CPAP machine, I couldn't stand wearing that thing. I found that if I am careful to what I eat before bed, I won't get apnea. Chocolate, is a big no no for me. Gives me apnea every time. When I mentioned this to the tech, he never heard about that. figures.
Posted 1/20/2015 1:01 PM (GMT -5)
Doug,

Not pleasant? Oh, I dunno. The two very pretty techs spent a long time trying to get the pads to stick to my fur. I seem to remember kinda liking the attention.
Posted 1/20/2015 1:13 PM (GMT -5)
I would also suggest a study for possible sleep apnea. I was diagnosed ten years ago and have been using CPAP therapy ever since. Can't sleep without it. Toss and turn all night and wake up gasping. Twice I've found myself out of town and unable to get home to use the machine. I now own three and keep one at home, one at our travel trailer, and one at the mother-in-law's house, just in case.

I love my CPAP machine. It's absolutely quiet. I no longer snore. (so my wife REALLY loves it). I can sleep on my back and breathe easily. The mask is comfortable and unobtrusive (I use the kind that has "nasal pillows" that only cover the nostrils, not the kind of mask that completely covers the nose).

Your problem might not be apnea, but if it is apnea, your blood oxygen level may well be dipping into the low 80's while you sleep: numbers sufficiently low that most paramedics would transport you to the E.R. if they discovered O2 levels that low. Imagine what that's doing to your organs and to your immune system over the long haul. It's definitely worth ruling in or out. Good luck, Todd.
Posted 1/20/2015 1:16 PM (GMT -5)
Todd –

Obviously, since fatigue can be a symptom of so very many things, some physical, some mental, it may well be in order to consult your physician if this keeps up, hoping s/he can get a handle on it.

Since there have been a number of votes for sleep apnea, you might consider that as a leading culprit possibility.

If it's stress related, it may simply be that the accumulation of all of the stress that you have endured for such a long time is finally starting to express itself in the fatigue you're feeling. I know I have read that an intense stress reaction can manifest itself in fatigue even years after the initial stress event. Medications could help here.

Another thing if it is indeed stress related. I have also read that a stress-and-sleep-disorder can turn into a vicious cycle, in that when stress effects sleep, worry over sleep loss may ensue, which then in turn increases the stress level, which then in turn then has further negative impact on the sleep level, and it goes on and on like that. You want to stay away from that kind of descent.

If this keeps up, then a trip to the doctor is in order, and you can start the conversation by bringing up apnea. Or could you possibly take a little time off to do nothing but rest, and see if that improves things, or you can't because you need to keep working? (But pressure to keep working equals even more stress added on, ugh, it never ends!)
Posted 1/20/2015 2:32 PM (GMT -5)
Hey Bro, sorry to hear you're going through this sleeplessness stuff. . . . I'm no doctor, and I can't weigh in on sleep apnea. Having said that I would put my two cents in to try and help - my initial thought is this is at least somewhat stress related, what you're dealing with at work (not to mention your own PCa stuff) is going to make that mind race at a thousand miles an hour - hard to slow that down enough to put the body to rest IMHO. . . . Another thought FWIW, perhaps along the lines of the sleep apnea topic - I know that personally I had issues with sleeping well a while ago. In my case some of it was stress for sure, but I've also come to realize that what I eat and when I eat late in the day would also create havoc for my trying to sleep. I've gotten around that by simply making my main meal of the day be at midday, and then at "supper time" I go with a salad, or cottage cheese and light veggies.

Not sure if any of this will help, but thinking of ya for sure.

As always my best Todd. . . .
Posted 1/20/2015 2:41 PM (GMT -5)
I read all of your posts and they made me stop and think. I know that I am really stressed out about financial issues and the lack of a contract as well as pending strike have got me sound pretty tight. We have also, since Christmas, been trying to get caught up on "The Walking Dead" ( we started from season 1 and just started season 3 last night. I don't believe I have apnea as I reAlly don't even snore and sleep i on my side. When I do fall asleep, providing the dog across the street doesn't bark I do pretty good. Stress,,,,,, perhaps
Posted 1/20/2015 2:55 PM (GMT -5)
dudes - sleep apnea?!? really. Yeah, let's jump right to the most complex solution and most difficult to diagnose. and the least likely...

I vote three times for stress most likely cause of you problems. That dog is a problem too, but likely not much you can do other than ear plugs. Todd, dude, what can you do to unstress yourself? The work thing has got to be a big stressor for you and money issues can do that.

I wish there was something I could do to help you out, other than saying, "that stuff sucks, hope you can sleep better soon." Hang tough my friend, it's got to get better soon.

Andrew
Posted 1/20/2015 3:09 PM (GMT -5)
When I was on HT I became anemic. My hemoglobin dropped to 8. I felt tired and working out was work. Found out during my yearly physical blood work. You could also try Ambien or Xanax but only short term as they are addictive.
Posted 1/20/2015 3:14 PM (GMT -5)
To me, if it was caused by stress he'd more likely be tossing and turning, thinking about stuff, getting out of bed, not sleeping, etc.  He said he's asleep 6.5 - 7.0 hours a night but wakes up tired.  Classic symptoms of sleep apnea.

I have a machine I don't wear as well. 

I think specialists can check people now for that without going for an overnight stay, like I did.  That'd be my first course of action.

I've been stressed because of a job, teenagers, money, women, etc.  There's a difference in not being able to sleep and feeling bad after sleep, in my opinion.

Posted 1/20/2015 3:31 PM (GMT -5)
I am getting my T level checked for fatigue. Prior to surgery i would never be laying in bed like i am now ever during day.

Dr says its normal but if a year ago i could code all friggin night and now I cant stay with it more than an hour at a time...

Thats too fast a dropoff and unlike the rest of my 40's.

Just a thought the T is supposed to impact lots of stuff justcask Arod.
Posted 1/20/2015 8:22 PM (GMT -5)
Todd,
I have had the same issues. I tend to take a lot of work problems home with me. It seems that when I get in bed, I sometimes play a video in my head about what I am going to do about the problems. This only aggravates me, and gets my heart rate up, and puts of my sleep. I have found that 10 mg of melatonin a half hour before I go to bed has helped. In extreme cases, I take a Xanax, but that is on a rare occasion.

Good luck,
Paul
Posted 1/20/2015 8:33 PM (GMT -5)
Todd,

Fatigue is one of my specialty fields, lol. Was diagnosed with Severe Chronic Fatigue back in 2000, so been dealing with it for 15 years. It has never improved, only worsened over the years, as each additional treatment, operation, etc. further impacted it.

As you experienced, with SCF, sleep often does not alleviate the issue. You can be just as tired, or worse, after waking up.

This is one reason I am still going to Oncology Rehab after nearly 4 years. Without the weekly PT routine, which isn't much, I would further decline. My doctors all agree on that one point.

Part of it has to do with acceptance. Based on recent advice I was given on the subject, there are simply times I (you too) need to back off, and get off your feet, and rest more. Pushing harder and deeper a lot of times only worsens the fatigue, and ends up being self defeating.

Quality is a precious commodity that I seldom see. On a good night, I might get 4-5 hours of broken sleep. Rarely, I may get a total of 6, but never more. Last night was typical of how things have been for me, I was awake all night until around 630 this morning, then I had to get up at 8 AM regardless, so 2 hours of troubled sleep.

Naps use to help me, but today, despite being so tired and fatigued, I lay down for 2 1/2 hours, and may have gotten a total of 15 minutes of sleep, at most. So got up feeling worse than when I lay down, only good thing, is that it got me off my feet during that time.

No easy answer. Some here have it due to HT of course, other's post surgery, others radiation. Part of its comes with the natural aging process, though you are much younger than some here.

All you can do, is the best you can do, and hope those around you realize that you are battling real fatigue. Sometimes, that is the hardest part to overcome.

Good luck in your own personal struggles
Posted 1/20/2015 9:17 PM (GMT -5)
Todd,

See a sleep specialist. Your insurance will cover it. There are innumerable reasons for sleep problems. I had sleep problems for many years and couldn't solve it. I went to a sleep specialist and he helped me--it took awhile--to sort out what was going on. I sleep very well now.
Posted 1/20/2015 9:48 PM (GMT -5)
Todd,

So sorry your having trouble resting. Wish I could help.

Cajun Jeff
Posted 1/20/2015 10:56 PM (GMT -5)
It seems that if I get a song stuck in my head it will play all night long. If I wake up it will be playing. I wake up multiple times a night. I do toss and turn. My arms and shoulders go numb. I just want this contract settled. I do believe it is stress. When Mandy and I met we had nothing. We have come a long way in a short time but our lives are largely co- owned by the bank for a few more years. The thought that we could soon be on a picket line and not getting paid scares the crap out of me. The company is threatening to lock us out. They say they will replace us. Ha ha..... They can't find anyone stupid enough to work for them now. Maybe they can hire all those who failed the drug test and were thus not called back. Yes....... It is stress. We go to Hawaii in a little over 2 months. It is already mostly paid for. I wish we weren't going but I would do anything to make Mandy's dreams come true. I also think I am afraid of the Santa barbara trip. We are flying on CMj bombardier aircraft. They are small computer 70 passenger jets. I am nervous about it. Lots on my mind.
Posted 1/20/2015 11:42 PM (GMT -5)
Sounds like stress to me.

how about trying a beer and re-watching all of the "Walking Dead"?

you got to do something to distract your mind.

I always get stressed when my paycheck is threatened...
Posted 1/20/2015 11:51 PM (GMT -5)
Todd, def sounds like stress, I think you probably know that.

I have trouble falling asleep and when I do, wake up a couple,times a night to pee. I've gotten into a late sleep cycle , since the surgery, which I hate. When I have a problem, I go to Netflix, and stream old episodes of Everybody Loves Raymond. I like that show, it helps me relax. Maybe if you found something like that that works for you? Sounds simplistic, but it might work. Anything to take your mind off of the BS of everyday life.
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