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N Acetyl cysteine with/after fecal transplant

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Ulcerative Colitis
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Posted 5/30/2014 8:48 AM (GMT -5)
Hi guys just a quick question i was hoping some of you could answer for me.

I've now done 14 Ft infusions over the pasted 3 weeks and tummy wise starting to feel better. I understand that l' glutamine is a great supplement to take during and after ft to heal my colon. However in the pasted few days i'm having real trouble with my joint pain. The two things i usually take for my joint pain are magnesium citrate 500mg daily and N acetyl cysteine:
My question is would both or one of these supplements interfere with my healthy gut flora and disrupt what ft is trying to achieve?
Or can anyone else recommend something that doesn't interfere with gut flora that may help.

Any help would be great full as my forearms are so painful right now and i don't know what to do.
Thanks Tom
Posted 5/30/2014 9:03 AM (GMT -5)
Who said magnesium citrate and N acetyl cysteine are helpful for joint pain? I know magnesium supplementation is usually a good idea since most people, especially IBDers, are deficient. But I never heard it helping joint pain. But if it works for you then who am I to question it.

Two very effective supplements for joint pain are fish oil and vitamin D. Get your blood levels of vitamin D checked since it is very effective for a host of ailments including IBD. Also chicken broth for joint pain and damping down IBD inflammation.

Neither magnesium, cysteine, fish oil or vitamin D should adversely affect your gut flora. Of course antibiotics would. And there is a growing consensus that GMO foods saturated with Roundup can kill off beneficial gut flora, so I would try to eat organic for a while.
Posted 5/30/2014 9:05 AM (GMT -5)
Hi tomie46 -

1) I don't think those things would disrupt gut flora, except maybe magnesium citrate @ very high doses... since it is used as a laxative prior to procedures.

You could try switching to chelated forms of magnesium like malate or glycinate, or possibly even try lower doses of citrate.

Are you also on vitamin k2? Magnesium needs to be balanced out with vitamin D, calcium and k2, so you may have to adjust some of those doses.

I found this supplementation guide very useful.

2) I don't take glutamine in isolation, but I do get the complete amino acid profile from dairy products, which already have generous amounts of glutamine present.

3) Have you tried making bone broth? Bone broth has natural glucosamine and chondratin, both of which are used to alleviate joint pains.

Best.
Posted 5/30/2014 9:19 AM (GMT -5)
I forgot something.

Before some clown starts questioning my sources again:

1) scientific review of magnesium
2) scientific review of glutamine
3) scientific review of NAC
4) scientific review of vitamin D
5) scientific review of vitamin k/k2

For Iamcurious:

6) scientific review of fish oil

I found the above links helpful as general guidelines on how to take the supplements.

Best.

Post Edited (Guardian7) : 5/30/2014 8:23:56 AM (GMT-6)

Posted 5/30/2014 9:21 AM (GMT -5)
Thanks for your replies.
Yeah i know its weird that it works but then again everything about my illness is weird.

My reason for thinking nac could disrupt flora is the fact it thins bile and rids toxins so could this rid all my good new flora?

Yes i do take a vitamin d supplement with mag citrate. What about epsom salts in a bath as this is a form of magnesium?

In England we don't tend to have much gmo foods and if so they're labeled.
Posted 5/30/2014 11:15 AM (GMT -5)
1) Epsom salt baths work just as well as transdermal magnesium oil (magnesium chloride). There was a pilot study done showing increased magnesium levels in participants after applying oil. You could give that a shot.

2) How much vit d are you taking?

Best.
Posted 5/30/2014 1:29 PM (GMT -5)
I may try that then thanks.

At the moment i take 2 500mcg capsules a week and try to get as much sun as possible.
Posted 5/30/2014 5:21 PM (GMT -5)
According to my calculations, 1000 mcg every week is approximately 3333 IU.

I am not sure if that is enough, as some science suggests that we need at the very least 2000 IU or 600 mcg a day. Sunlight also varies based on pollution levels in cities. I live in an urban area and I know for sure that I am not getting enough sunlight, even though it's summer time around here.

Did you get your levels tested?
Posted 5/30/2014 6:38 PM (GMT -5)
The only way to know for sure is to get tested and get tested periodically. I play golf and go to the beach and still need 5,000 iu of vitamin D3 a day to keep my level around 50 ng/ml. Optimum levels are 40-60, some say 50-70. IBDers probably need more than others to reach the optimum range.

Of course levels will probably vary by the season. Late winter might have lower accumulation of D3 than late summer.
Posted 5/31/2014 11:27 AM (GMT -5)
I got tested last month and my levels were 48 which is pretty good but i'm still taking Vit d.

Just been to my local pharmacy and couldn't get any magnesium oil so brought some epsom salts (magnesium sulphate) will try that in a bath.

Bad news on the fmt front my doner (mum) has an infection so will have to take antibiotics therefore will have to stop the infusions at 14.
Posted 5/31/2014 11:54 AM (GMT -5)
48 is pretty decent, though bumping it up a bit more wouldn't hurt.

Sorry to hear about your donor. Seems like everyone is on antibiotics these days, and that rules out so many people as candidates.
Posted 5/31/2014 12:11 PM (GMT -5)
Yeah thats what i thought.

Yeah its antibiotic season. Its a shame you have to wait so long after antibiotics to be a donor again.
Posted 6/2/2014 10:25 AM (GMT -5)
Don't take NAC when you try FMT. It is a weak antibiotic against many bacteria. It also effects your mucus and I just wouldn't be messing with that while doing an FMT. You can take it prior with your antibiotics. I would never get an FMT from a parent as they are part of the reason you have your flora to begin with. I'd find a healthy non related donor who eats a diet you can continue after FMT. It's imperative you eat the diet of that person your bacteria are just gonna take back over. FMT without diet change is worthless for UC.
Posted 6/2/2014 10:41 AM (GMT -5)
I did think that thats why i had my doubts i've been on it for about 4 days now already so don't know what to do.

My bad stomach flora comes from my dads side so thats why i opted for my mum as a donor.

I am including some carbs with fibre into my diet in order to help the new flora flourish but not eating the high amounts of brown bread which my donor consumed as gluten really does cause my symptoms to get worse.

Thanks for the advise though.
Posted 6/2/2014 11:42 AM (GMT -5)
You got your gut flora from your mama to begin with. It didnt all come "from your dad's side" now the genes that you have that your mama doesnt that make the flora not work for you may come from your dad's side, but you wont fix that with an FMT. Since she is being treated for an infection, what about you?

So you did an FMT with no prior course of ABX ...

Good luck with that.
Posted 6/2/2014 12:59 PM (GMT -5)
No i don't have the infection so no need for antibiotics.

Yes i did take metronidazole and rifraxim for 14days before starting fmt.
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