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I'm probably either flaring mildly or have a GI infection...

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Posted 7/28/2022 4:03 PM (GMT -5)
Hello. Well, I knew as soon as I made my post about being in remission for a year, something would probably happen. Having diarrhea on and off with mushy stools that are often really thin/narrow (mushy is somewhat my normal and sometimes I have kind of narrow stools even when I think I'm in remission, so that doesn't really say much). Having lots of gut gurgling/churning and urgency. I was walking down my long driveway to get the mail 2 or 3 days ago and felt like I might have to go. On the way back up, I didn't know if I could hold it, so I jumped off the side of my driveway (I'm luckily surrounded by woods) and had explosive diarrhea and used junk mail to wipe my butt... That was a first.

No blood and my pain is very mild and intermittent, so this isn't a typical flare for me and I don't know what's going on. Maybe 2 or 3 weeks ago, I did notice having some very mild pain in the left side but it went away. Then nearly 2 weeks ago, I had a migraine and took half a Zofran, which always makes me extremely constipated. I usually take Miralax for 2 or 3 days after and go back to normal. This time, I took Miralax, didn't have a BM for 2.5 days, then went to the bathroom 12 times in one day, and kept having that feeling of needing to go as soon as I stopped...not as bad as when flaring but I felt inflamed. Then I again didn't go to the bathroom at all for 2 days. Then went one day. Then not at all for a day. And then the diarrhea started earlier this week, but I don't think I've gone more than 3 or 4 times a day so far, so it isn't at all like my normal flares where I'm stuck in the bathroom all day and night. I don't have much of an appetite but no nausea.

My GI (who is not local to my area...I use a different lab from his hospital...) ordered an infectious GI panel and calprotectin which I dropped off today. Well, I was negative for all the infections this hospital tested for but they didn't even include c diff or parasites like giardia so now I have to drive 40 minutes back and submit another sample for those because they already froze the rest of my remaining sample to send off for the calprotectin test. AND I need a special container for the parasites so I will likely have to drive to get that, drive home, then drive back again to drop it off. I'm frustrated because my GI thought all that was being tested in his GI enteric panel test he ordered. This is why I almost always ask the lab to tell me every single thing I'm being tested for while I'm there.

I have been dealing with mice in my house all summer. I was trying to trap and release them, but I was stupid and wasn't releasing them miles away and I may have too many for it to work anyway and the pest control guy said the house I rent is too old to even try to seal up every possible crack they might enter through. So, now I finally decided to have him put poison bait boxes out even though I feel horrible about killing them and I'm also worried about my cat. Anyway, I've been dealing with cleaning up a lot of mouse poop, including in my kitchen, for months now. That's why I wondered if maybe I had an infection. I wash my hands a ton and thoroughly.

I also took 4 days of a very harsh antibiotic called doxycycline in early June. My calprotectin test earlier this month was higher than normal for me as well, so I don't know what's going on. I was tested for c diff a few weeks ago though and it was negative then.

I've also been extremely exhausted the past couple months but I also quit smoking using nicotine replacement in May, and it makes me sleep terribly so I chocked the exhaustion up to that. But now I'm wondering if the nicotine is making me flare (I'm one of the few who got UC as a smoker and flared when I returned to smoking...it's never helped me). I want to try getting off the nicotine gum ASAP.

I know what quincy's going to advise me to do... I had boxes of enemas stored in this back closet in my laundry room that was covered in mouse poop (the closet floor was, not all the boxes, but they were sitting on the ground stacked up). I'm now concerned about them. There were probably 3 months' worth in there, still wrapped in foil and in boxes. I threw some away. I don't know if I should just throw them all out and get more. They're all a year old anyway.
Posted 7/28/2022 8:34 PM (GMT -5)
Oh no! I would put money on this being from the antibiotics. The enemas could still be good, if they are sealed and not expired I would use them. Hope you get answers from all those tests and sorry about the poop situation (yours and the mice).
Posted 7/28/2022 8:43 PM (GMT -5)
Sorry to hear this. There is a lot going on that could be causing the problems. The description of the sudden explosive diarrhea sounds like some sort or virus or parasite and with that level of mouse infestation it's had to tell what could do to you.

A few months ago you thought you were starting to flare and you increased your xeljanz and that resolved everything. Though until you rule out infection or parasites you probably should wait on that.

As long as the enemas were still sealed in the foil bag the mouse poop wouldn't do anything to them. Just make sure the enema isn't discolored and they will be safe to use. Though if you are concerned about them just get a new script.
Posted 7/29/2022 2:40 PM (GMT -5)
Oh wow...just what you don't need. Yep, enemas first suggestion. I hope the results from your samples don't take too long.

How is Pumpkin doing?

q
Posted 7/30/2022 6:39 AM (GMT -5)
Have you tested for covid?
Posted 7/30/2022 12:54 PM (GMT -5)
Thanks all. Can't believe anyone actually read through (or skimmed) my embarrassingly long post, ha. All the bacteria/viruses came back negative (campylobacter, salmonella, rotavirus, shigella, norovirus, few other things). Still waiting on calprotectin results. I'm dropping off the parasite and c diff sample in a few minutes at a different hospital because the first was out of the needed cups and said they were on back order! So, I had to call around to find another hospital that could even run the test for me.

Yesterday I didn't go at all again, but I also didn't eat much. This morning I went and it was formed/mushy, with a little mucous, still no detectable blood.

mom: Thanks! The mice thank you, ha. I don't know how bad the infestation is. It's not like I am seeing mice hardly ever but it's just been a lot of mouse poop! I bought 8 catch and release traps and put them all out earlier this week and only caught 6 one night, then the next only 2. I'm finally driving them 3 miles away now instead of just putting them far back of my yard. I guess they can smell their way back "home" from over a mile away! I probably don't have anything from them though. It sounds pretty rare and I do wash my hands thoroughly.

CC: Thanks, I thought the same. Also may be wishful thinking on my part...never wanting it to be a flare! But yeah, I was already thinking about upping my Xeljanz soon if things don't clear up.

quincy: Thanks. Pumpkin is doing well. I may not get the surgery done. I'm really wondering if this vet misdiagnosed her with a full tear instead of a partial tear in her knee ligament because her symptoms just don't fit. She still has a bit of a limp but it comes and goes. Other than that, she is not really acting like she's in pain. She still jumps up on things, plays, eats, grooms, everything else seems normal other than this limp and this clicking sound in her leg, which I think is a "meniscal click." I am planning to get a second opinion. I've spent hours trying to research all of this online and there's quite a lot of conflicting information and it's hard to know what's right to do for her. I know she would not tolerate being crated for 6 weeks and then confined to a room for another 2 well at all. Thanks for asking.

poopy-Have not tested for covid. I have some at-home tests I could do. Thanks for the suggestion!
Posted 7/30/2022 8:35 PM (GMT -5)
Why doesn’t pumpkin keep the mice away? Also I would have started the enemas right away. Keep us posted. Also mice omg my biggest fear ever … and you caught 8 so far oh no: I’d die
Posted 7/30/2022 10:16 PM (GMT -5)
Haha. Oh, I've caught way more than 8, that was just in 2 days last week, ha. But I was dumb and just releasing them back by my pond all summer, and youre supposed to drive them miles away but that is so time consuming!! They're actually really cute but yeah, I admit I do scream like a little girl the handful of times I've actually seen one run across my kitchen floor! Once, one jumped out of my trash as I threw something in it. I screamed so loud my cat ran in to check on me. Lol. Just startled me. She is a good hunter but these mice are very sneaky and hide in places she can't reach for the most part and they are mostly active while she's sleeping at night. But yeah, it definitely would be nice if she could help a little, lol. She loves to hunt things, too! You live out in the country, right? Do you ever get mice? [Edit: Sorry, I was thinking of clo.] The catch and release traps are nice. You don't have to touch the mice or anything. You just put peanut butter in as a bait.

Yeah, I should do the enemas. I haven't used more than 1 or 2 in a year now and really don't want to, lol. Hope you're doing alright!

Post Edited (Sara14) : 7/30/2022 10:30:32 PM (GMT-7)

Posted 7/31/2022 12:10 AM (GMT -5)
Sara,

I am so sorry you are not feeling well. Running off in the trees after walking down your long driveway and using junk mail was something I had to do a few times... So I understand what you are going thru.

It could be the antibiotics. I was on doxycycline and Cipro awhile back and my infectious disease doctor said to watch out for flares or issues for up to 12 weeks. (Sorta scared me into not wanting to take those meds again)

Please let us know how your tests turn out.

I have 2 barn cats. They run away from mice.... They Leap straight up and hang on the screens howling like a wild animal if the roosters come around. On the mice - I eventually got tired of catch and release and just got the nasty traps. ☹️ I even called the professionals in. (Mouse poop is dangerous, so please be careful. He told me to spray bleach on the poop and let it sit for 10 to 15 minutes and then to use a designated broom to gently sorta sweep/scoop it into plastic bags and to toss it outside immediately. If poo was on an outer container he said to get it off, bleach the container next...for another 10 minutes.., unwrap, discard outer packaging and to wash my hands really well. I did it cause he scared the daylights outta me...but he could have been over reacting... Plus even he didn't completely solve our field mice issue..) The last 2 years a group of hawks took up residence near the garage/barn. I don't have any mice now. I hope they never leave. I'm scared of mice.....

Hang in there!
Clo
Posted 7/31/2022 12:45 AM (GMT -5)
Thanks, clo! I should know c diff and parasite results by Monday. I kinda think now I'm just flaring mildly though. Its just weird because I dont feel all that bad and it comes and goes. Usually, my flares went from 0 to 100 in a matter of says in the past. Doxy is a horrible medicine. I couldn't tolerate it. I've done well on Cipro but come to think of it, I did get c diff after several rounds of cipro (and a hospital stay).

Too funny about your barn cats. My cat loves to hunt. She usually doesn't kill whatever she catches, just brings it into our house and drops it! I once spent hours trying to get a chipmunk out that she brought in. The thing was terrified and hiding under my couch. Happened another time with a bird...that was worse because she injured the bird's leg, and I felt terrible.

Yeah, the catch and release traps are becoming totally exhausting. They take up so much time and energy. I only caught one mouse tonight. The pest guy is supposed to come next week. Thanks for the tips regarding cleaning. I already threw out some stuff, including my toaster because I was like how the heck do I disinfect this if they got in there, which I think they likely did for crumbs. I bought a new broom tonight bc Ive probably cross contaminated my whole house at this point using my old 2 brooms on poop. I guess I could soak them in bleach water. I plan to mop everything and deep clean like crazy after it's been a week or 2 without seeing any droppings.

The whole ordeal is exhausting. We have tons of owls but these mice have taken up residence in my house, I guess. I was dumb and had a big bad of birdseed in that room all winter and they got into a sealed bag and I didn't notice until much later. Now I'm never even going to feed the birds anymore.
Posted 7/31/2022 2:02 AM (GMT -5)
Sara,

I've done the same things! Fortunately I was too lazy to bring the seed into the house and left it in the barn. The mice were everywhere! I try to be nice to the animals but when it's overwhelming I just resort to getting thru that time period and feel guilty later. Once I left my prescriptions on top of the trunk of the car... Hey I saw a mouse and ran to the house.... came back the next morning and they'd chewed thru my ostomy bag box and the bags. Mouse poop inside the little box.... And they got my steroid cream for my rashes. I had to toss it all. What a mess. That's when I got alittle meaner. Paying for your scripts because Insurance won't will change you... Lol... I put out that pellet mouse poison. The mice just gathered it all up and left it in a pile in the middle of the garage. When I tried to put it inside the peanut butter they just wouldn't go near the pb. I tried coke in a saucer.... But that didn't work either. The exterminator said the mice were coming in from the field. He did a better job...but he brought in non venomous snakes for my fields. I spent the fall trying to run over the snakes with my riding lawn mower... My neighbor with the roosters - she swears the mice don't come into the garage where she lets the chickens in. (I dunno about that though)

Sometimes when I am in a "mini-flare" I have intermittent pain, diarrhea, nausea, fatigue, night sweats. One day I'll be fine, the next all heck breaks out and then the next I'll be fine again. Blood tests don't always indicate a flare. The doctor used to look at me like I was making it up... But after 7 years he now just rolls his eyes and calls in more meds.... Although his PA tried to say it was IBS.

Crossing my fingers that it levels out soon.

Clo

Can you try eating yogurt and the SCD diet? That's what I do after antibiotics and during mini flares. It helps most of the time for me - but doesn't help my friend.

And zofran... It literally puts me to sleep and causes severe constipation. I poop rabbit pellets thru the ostomy with so much force it "pings" when it hits the ostomy bag. Lol... I don't know what I'd do if it was my back end. At least I can see what's going on in there .. I know... TMI.
Posted 7/31/2022 12:14 PM (GMT -5)
Omg about the ostomy bag and micr...that would suck. And what the heck did they want with your steroid cream?!? Yes, they started going through my cat's litterbox every night!!! I actually wondered if that was attracting them too because I switched to a natural litter made out of corn about a year ago. I really like the natural litter but just switched back to a clay one last week and haven't noticed mouse poop or tracks in it since.

Wow, he brought in snakes?! At first I forgot they were in your barn and thought he brought snakes into your house, lol! Yeah, sometimes there is only so much we can do. I'm vegan and it kills me to kill an animal but I'm at the point, I don't see other options than the poison bait boxes. That's crazy even that didn't work for you. Maybe because they're field mice and there are so many from outside? I figured mine were field mice too but my boyfriend said house mice look different? I don't know. I'm sure they came in from outside originally but probably had babies in my house. I didn't wake up to any fresh poop today but I feel like if I don't do the poison, it will be an ongoing issue and it's so stressful. I never wanted poison out because of my cat too but I'm going to only do the bait boxes and have him place them in places she can't get to. He told me she'd have to eat a ton of mice to get secondary poisoning and I've never seen her actually eat any animal.

Yeah, you're right. My flares can be that way too, I guess, especially if it's still in the mild phase. That's probably what it is. And yeah, my bloodwork and even calprotectin often dont indicate anything. Ive been given the IBS line as well. I don't even know if the enemas would help anymore because they didn't seem to the last year I used them. Guess I should try. It's driving me nuts not having my c diff results yet. I usually get them posted on MyChart but had to go to a new hospital for the parasite test and they didn't give me the proper invite to their MyChart.

Yep, Zofran constipation is terrible! I'd rather have diarrhea. I can try eating some vegan yogurt. I bought some yesterday. I don't really see much difference from diet though. Thanks!
Posted 7/31/2022 12:33 PM (GMT -5)
Clo: I had a suitcase (cloth exterior) in the closet where they pooped a lot. I don't know how to disinfect it. Should I just throw it away, do you think? I barely ever travel or use it in the past decade anyway.
Posted 7/31/2022 3:14 PM (GMT -5)
I would throw the suitcase away...🙄
q
Posted 7/31/2022 6:33 PM (GMT -5)
FYI — this is an old wives tale so don’t know if it actually works but what the heck it can’t hurt — they say rodents don’t like the odor of Irish spring soap. So you can cut the bars in half or thirds and stick them in your silverware drawers or wherever. Again, don’t know if it works or not but it’s a fairly cheap preventative that might help keep them out of your dishes and such. Won’t kill them or get them under control of course though.
Posted 8/1/2022 12:23 AM (GMT -5)
Oh gosh.... I am a germaphob. I think I might throw it away... Unless it cost a bunch of money. Then I'd wash it outside, spray it with Lysol, leave it out in the sunshine for hours, wash it again, let dry in the sun and then spray it with Lysol one last time. (I told you---germaphob)

On the snakes. I think they were rat snakes. We didn't go in the garage for a week or two. 2 of them got out of the barn and went in the fields by our house. I tried to mow over them but was not successful. I know that's awful but they looked sorta like rattle snakes. It actually stood up and struck out at the mower. Scared the daylights outta me. They usually aren't aggressive unless something is coming at them. My spouse went out with a rake and moved it to the back 10 acres....I raced around on the mower screaming "kill it, kill it". Lol.. My male neighbor across the street on 300 acres heard me clear inside his house and came over to investigate. He and my spouse laughed so hard at me that they could not breathe. They could not believe how vicious I was over alittle rat snake... Or how fast I could get the lawn tractor to go to get away from them carting that snake to the back field. So.... I don't recommend the snake thing if you are scared of snakes. (Although they did eat most of the mice and it is nature's way to control the mice population) Now we have rat snakes in our fields and hawks that hunt both the snakes and the mice so it's a win win.... I guess. (My spouse doesn't lets me on the tractor right now. We are trying to make sure the mice stay gone.)

And yes mice do like kitty litter. Be careful with that poison and Pumpkin. Roosters Mom used those pellet poisons and her dogs got into them. She had a huge vet bill. Her cat is an outside cat so it didn't get into it.

Flowersgal--I heard that too. I put Irish Spring in my drawers and in my closets... Packed my extra bedding in those vacuum bags with a piece of soap in them.... And I haven't found a mouse dropping in anyplace I put them...yet. I don't know if that's because of the poison and snakes or what. I was desperate though. Who knew field mice could be a problem like that?

Sara, try not to let this stress you out. Please let us know how the tests turn out. I'm crossing my fingers and toes--hoping you feel better soon.

Clo
Posted 8/1/2022 12:47 PM (GMT -5)
Thanks all. Yeah, I'm only putting bait boxes out and in places she can't even access, like behind the washer and in certain closets. It doesn't sound like cats can get in bait boxes anyway. I haven't even seen any poop last 2 days so it's probably not as bad a problem really as I thought once i started releasing them far away.

C diff is negative. Giardia says pending until tonight at 9 pm. Not sure why.
Posted 8/1/2022 1:44 PM (GMT -5)

Sara14 said...
I haven't even seen any poop last 2 days so it's probably not as bad a problem really as I thought once i started releasing them far away.

... or they haven't been able to travel that far on their little legs to get back to you yet lol

Several years ago I saw a couple mice and heard them in the walls. When I called pest control he determined that I had a pretty large mouse population in one of my crawl spaces (lots of mouse poop). He put a bunch of bait boxes in there and that took care of the problem. I was worried about my neighbor's cats getting them after they had eaten the poison and was told the same as you -- the cats would have to eat a lot of poisoned mice to be affected. Neighbor never noticed any problems.
Posted 8/1/2022 5:27 PM (GMT -5)
I started releasing them 3 miles away just last week (at the community gardens here, lol--they now have a huge compost pile with garden waste to munch on...if they survive out there...). There is no way they are finding their way back anymore! Lol. I wish I had done that from the beginning, but it takes so much time, especially if you're having to drive them one at a time! And of course when they start coming out more, it's usually already nighttime so I'm wanting to settle down and get ready for bed, not hop in my car to relocate mice, ha. I always close my traps when I go to bed because I don't want them trapped in one for that long. Of course, even if I caught and released every single mouse inside right now, without being able to close up every gap in my old house, I'm sure more will eventually find their way back in. One of the downsides of living out in the woods, I guess.

Thanks for the reassurance regarding my cat! I did a ton of research on it and that's the conclusion I came to as well. Glad to hear also that the poison resolved the issue for you. The pest control guy thinks mine may be in the walls as well. Kind of creepy to think about. Although not nearly as creepy as thinking about someone releasing snakes into my house or even yard to take care of the mice, like clo's situation---ha. I know I have snakes out here and also tons of owls and hawks. I'm hoping the owls don't eat poisoned mice, but I am sure my neighbors in the area also use poison anyway. Only so much we can do in these situations, I suppose.
Posted 8/1/2022 5:36 PM (GMT -5)
I'm getting really impatient for these giardia and calprotectin results. Hope to get the calpro back tomorrow. The lab told me giardia was complete and in their system this morning, but neither I nor my GI can see the result when we check my chart! GI said they were going to ask their medical assistant to reques tthe result. I hate that they can't just tell me it over the phone.

But today I've mostly been normal again! I went once, formed stools but narrow, and that's it. However, my life has been chaotic (personal issues/lots of stress) and I don't always eat regularly on extremely stressful days, which I know isn't good. Also, my sleep is still terrible. I'm not taking very good care of myself overall.
Posted 8/1/2022 6:48 PM (GMT -5)
Hopefully it was just some sort of intestinal bug and you are now recovering from it. ~fingers crossed~
Posted 8/1/2022 7:03 PM (GMT -5)
I flared last year after a two week round of doxycycline. I was on oral and foam budesonide until early December, had a colonoscopy in Feb and that sent me off again. Hope you can snap back sooner than I did!!
Posted 8/1/2022 7:51 PM (GMT -5)
Calpro results from Thursday came back. It's high: 271. That's up from 66 in early July. However, sometimes I get pretty low calprotectin and have bad symptoms. For me, whenever I'm on prednisone or have zero symptoms, it's usually below 30.

I'm probably flaring but it's weird it hasn't gotten bad. Still waiting for the giardia results.
Posted 8/1/2022 7:53 PM (GMT -5)

tiredofallthispoop said...
I flared last year after a two week round of doxycycline. I was on oral and foam budesonide until early December, had a colonoscopy in Feb and that sent me off again. Hope you can snap back sooner than I did!!

That sucks. I only took it for 4 days and that was the first week in June so I don't know? I have missed a lot of medicine doses and got bad sleep for months so that could also be why. Or just luck of the draw. I'm getting scoped in September and worried that will make me flare or make it get worse if I already am flaring.
Posted 8/2/2022 12:12 AM (GMT -5)
Oh gosh Sara,

I'm.Sorry that your numbers were high. It seems as though your body is trying to fight it off though.

That doxycycline is nasty stuff. I have a colostomy and it still drove me crazy. I had diarrhea, trapped gas, and then a yeast infection in all my body fold areas. (Where my legs met my torso, back of knees, inside elbows...) I read on here (I think) that someone used GermX on theirs 2 times daily and it went away in a week... So I did that and it killed it off. Burned like crazy the first few days though. I also made SCD yogurt and ate that. (Yeast infection happened almost 7 weeks after I took that stuff...)

Glad your little friends haven't found a way home yet! One of my barn cats (Droopy) caught a mouse today and very gingerly carried it kicking and squirming from the barn up to the house and then he let it go. I can only shake my head at that one.The mouse ran away making the saddest little noise... And the other cat... (Snoopy) just sat on the porch rail and watched... I gotta get some real cats....

Crossing my fingers that you continue to improve and your mice problem is resolved.

Clo.
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